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Queen Swanwhite

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Queen Swanwhite

Postby Aravis Narnia » Jan 03, 2010 8:21 am

When did she live?

The Narnia Chronology Book mentions her as living sometime after the Pevensies were Kings and Queens of Narnia, but before the Telmarines took over Narnia.

However, if I read and remember correctly from LB, she lived before Jadis put Narnia under a winter spell. But I may have misread or made an incorrect assumption. I had assumed she was a descendant of Frank and Helen, but if the Chronology Book is right, she is likelier to have come from somewhere else- maybe Archenland?

Where is Queen Swanwhite placed in the chronology? Not much is known about her other than she was beautiful.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 04, 2010 7:50 am

In LB it is indeed told that she lived before Jadis' enchanted winter.
When Lewis put her after the Golden Age in his chronology, he must have either changed his mind or forgotten what he had written first.

It's possible that her history had gotten confused over the centuries and that the person who told about her in LB had gotten the time wrong.

My own theory (which is useful for fanfiction ;) ) is that there were two of them, the second perhaps even named after the first one.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby DamselJillPole » Jan 17, 2010 12:45 am

Really? I honestly thought she Queen of Narnia 300 years after the Pevensie's left. There's not that much information on her besides the timetable and that she was extremely beautiful.

Varnafinde where did you get the information from? I didn't know there were two.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Gwendolen » Jan 17, 2010 10:38 am

In his timeline Lewis has Swanwhite living about 500 years after the White Witch was defeated, but Jewel does say she lived before the White Witch. Lewis wasn't terribly careful to be consistent. I suppose Varnafinde's explanation would solve the problem, though I doubt Lewis thought of it. ;))
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 17, 2010 2:24 pm

DamselJillPole wrote:Varnafinde where did you get the information from? I didn't know there were two.


It's not information, it's merely my theory, my own guess, to explain why Lewis was contradicting himself. :ymblushing:

I guess the real reason he contradicted himself was that he had forgotten what he had said the first time. ;)

I suppose he only meant to have one Queen Swanwhite. But I sometimes like to pretend that there were two of them.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Aravis Narnia » Jan 18, 2010 6:52 am

It is likely there were two of them. I know C.S. Lewis was absent minded and not very detail oriented. But this still does not prevent the existence of two very beautiful women named Swanwhite in the land of Narnia.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 18, 2010 2:18 pm

And if there were two, they may have been mixed up a little - we don't really know which one of them was beautiful enough to have ponds retaining their image, but I doubt that would be both of them. I would guess it would be the first one, but that the same would be attributed to the second one as well when they got confused with each other.

Assuming there were two rather than one, that is ;)
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby [wrath] » Jan 18, 2010 5:24 pm

Has anybody thought about the fact that Swanwhite could have lived for a very long time?
She didn't have to be a witch or anything, she just could haved had a very long life! :p
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 19, 2010 12:41 pm

In the two pieces of information about her, she's said to have lived either before the White Witch's enchanted winter, or some centuries after the Pevensies have left Narnia.

She couldn't have been a Queen through both of those events ;)
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby DiGoRyKiRkE » Jan 21, 2010 8:22 am

We mustn't go off of the assumption that because she was a "queen" that she was in control over the country of Narnia during this time. Caspian is called a "king" in PC, even though he has no control whatsoever.

There isn't a thing wrong with saying that one Swanwhite could have reigned for several hundred years. Dryads, for instance live as long as their trees are alive, which could be for hundreds of years. So she could be a dryad, or a naiad, or any number of long-lived creatures that was a sort of "underground monarch" during the reign of the white witch, and the Pevensies.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby CorazonBandido55 » Jan 21, 2010 1:21 pm

Its unfortunate that so little information is known about Swanwhite. And we will never really know much more about her than what we already know. Im assuming that CS Lewis added her name in the timeline with hopes that someday he would write a book about her. Oh well, its all up to fanfiction now.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 21, 2010 3:33 pm

DiGoRyKiRkE wrote:So she could be a dryad, or a naiad, or any number of long-lived creatures that was a sort of "underground monarch" during the reign of the white witch, and the Pevensies.


But somebody would have known about her. It wouldn't make sense for there to be an underground queen who is absolutely unknown - unless she was in hibernation? ;)
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby DiGoRyKiRkE » Jan 21, 2010 6:34 pm

Where does it say in the book that she is unknown, Varnafinde? If Jewel knew a minute detail like the one concerning her face in the pool, then logically he would have known a good deal more. Just because he didn't spill his guts, and say everything that he knew, doesn't mean that there wasn't any more to say.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby Varnafinde » Jan 21, 2010 7:14 pm

I mean that if she were alive during the Pevensie's reign, somebody would have known about her then, but she isn't mentioned. Having an ancient Queen around alongside the Pevensies, doesn't make sense to me, with the way the prophesies had spoken.

She is certainly well-known at Jewel's time - whether they were confusing two Queens into one, or confusing what era the one Queen had lived in.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby wolfloversk » Feb 18, 2010 9:15 am

DiGoRyKiRkE wrote:So she could be a dryad, or a naiad, or any number of long-lived creatures that was a sort of "underground monarch" during the reign of the white witch, and the Pevensies.


But, "Narnia was never right unless a Son of Adam was king." I'm assuming this includes humans as queens as well. A major problem was never mentioned during her reign, leading one to beleive that she had to be human. However she could have been enchanted by some witch. A spell may have been cast over her, this would support Jewel's claim about a reflection.

I like the idea of there being 2 Swanwhites. Kings and queens on earth are always being named after each other, so why not in Narnia. In fact it happened there too. The Caspians for example or the Franks.
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Re: Queen Swanwhite

Postby daughter of the King » Feb 18, 2010 3:51 pm

wolfloversk wrote: DiGoRyKiRkE wrote:So she could be a dryad, or a naiad, or any number of long-lived creatures that was a sort of "underground monarch" during the reign of the white witch, and the Pevensies.



But, "Narnia was never right unless a Son of Adam was king." I'm assuming this includes humans as queens as well. A major problem was never mentioned during her reign, leading one to beleive that she had to be human.

Not necessarily: King Frank and Queen Helen and their children live happily in Narnia and their second son became King of Archenland. The boys married nymphs and the girls married wood-gods and river-gods. MN, The End of This Story

If she lived before the time of the White Witch, she could very easily have been a nymph, or at least part nymph. However, I have found a few other discrepancies with the timeline that don't quite line up with the books leading me to think it was a draft. Such as: 1. Edmund was born in 1930, Lucy was born in 1932. The books state that there was only a year's difference between them (that one could be argued depending on what month they were born in). 2. Caspian's voyage occurs in 2306-7. He doesn't marry Ramandu's Daughter until 2310. Arguably, they could have waited to get married and have Caspian court RD. But, Caspian does not sail that far again until SC. Would RD really sail with Caspian before they were married?
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