Chapter 8: What Happened After Dinner

[Lady Arwen]

Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?

Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?

What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?

Now that we have gotten to know the Beavers, what are their strongest attributes? What are their weakest attributes? Do they balance each other out? If so, how?

What else stood out to you about this chapter? What did you like? What did you dislike?

[King_Erlian]

1. Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?
If we imagine that these prophecies are equivalent to Biblical prophecies about Jesus, then the answer has to be (ultimately) the Emperor-over-Sea, or Aslan himself. Who in the mortal Narnian world first proclaimed them is a mystery - maybe the Centaurs?

2. Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?
He must have been reacting to the feeling he got when Aslan's name was mentioned; also he could see the logic of their being unable to rescue Edmund themselves and he wanted to do so; Edmund was still his brother even if he'd "turned bad". If meeting Aslan was the only chance to do it, then meet Aslan he must.

3. What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?
If Aslan is the King, then if he decides that he wants to eat the children, he will do so - no-one can stop him. But he chooses not to.

4. Now that we have gotten to know the Beavers, what are their strongest attributes? What are their weakest attributes? Do they balance each other out? If so, how?
Mr. Beaver does seem a bit fond of his own voice, imparting wisdom when he might not be quite as clever as he likes to think he is. Mrs. Beaver seems a bit fussy, like a parent or grandparent. However they are both generous and courageous, feeding the children and risking their own lives to bring them to Aslan.

5. What else stood out to you about this chapter? What did you like? What did you dislike?
Another thought:

Where did Mr. Beaver get his ideas about the Witch's origins from, especially given that we see something of her origins later on in "The Magician's Nephew"? Can the two stories be reconciled (e.g. could Adam's first wife Lilith have gone from our world to Charn, or from Charn to our world, or could Adam have come from Charn originally) or is Mr. Beaver just plain wrong?

(By the way, I've just had a small bar of Turkish Delight with my lunch. Very nice. )

[ValiantArcher]

1. That's a good question. King_Erlian is right that they probably ultimately came from the Emperor-over-the-Sea or Aslan, but didn't dryads and/or centaurs prophesy? I think it likely that one of them spoke the prophecies and gave them to the Narnians.

2. I think it may be because of the earlier reaction to hearing about Aslan; Peter (and the others, I think) understand that Aslan is wonderful, even if they don't know who he is exactly. Maybe?

3. Aslan is capable of and does destroy his enemies (such as the White Witch) and is then also physically capable of doing the same to others. But because he is good, the children don't really have cause to fear harm from him.

[aileth]

I had never noticed before that Tumnus mentions the prophecy of the four thrones, back in Chapter 2. I always thought that it was first brought up by the Beavers. Of course, here they expand on it a good deal, along with what they know about Aslan. I wonder if she recalled Tumnus's words at this point?

Perhaps Lucy wouldn't have paid attention to that one small detail, as it had nothing to do with her, as far as she knew at the time. Nor would she have told her siblings; after all, if they wouldn't believe her story, it's unlikely that she would discuss all that had occurred.

[Pattertwigs Pal]

Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?
It is likely they got it from the centaurs since they are often prophets and stargazers.
Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?
For one thing he gets a strange pleasant feeling whenever Aslan's name is mentioned. I'm sure he wants to know why. Plus the Beavers had good things to say about Aslan.
What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?
Good - Alsan will not do anything that is wrong.
not safe - He can hurt and kill if the situation demands it. He can change people, ask hard things of them, scold them, and convict them.
Now that we have gotten to know the Beavers, what are their strongest attributes? What are their weakest attributes? Do they balance each other out? If so, how?
Mr. Beaver is a leader he does most of the talking. He is nice but not as gentle in speech. Mrs. Beaver is good in domestic tasks. She is kind and motherly. They seem to make a good team, so I guess they do balance each other out because a good team usually has some kind of balance on it.

[The Rose-Tree Dryad]

Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?

Probably a centaur. I think there's a good chance it was the same centaur that prophesied that baby Cor was one day going to save Archenland.

Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?

Probably because of the reaction Peter had upon hearing Aslan's name, and because of the great reverence that the Beavers had for him. Also, Peter was already interested in majestic animals, as we see in Chapter One, so that may have played a role as well.

What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?

In short: it means that if you do wrong and you are not sorry for it, then he will make you sorry. (Example: Aravis.) However, if you do wrong and you are genuinely sorry and own up to it, then he will gladly forgive you.

Now that we have gotten to know the Beavers, what are their strongest attributes? What are their weakest attributes? Do they balance each other out? If so, how?

They seem like a lovely couple to me. I can't really think of any weak attributes that we've seen from Mrs. Beaver by this point, but Mr. Beaver's assertion that there have never been any humans in Narnia before bothers me. Not sure if Lewis just hadn't conceived of the plot for The Magician's Nephew yet or if Mr. Beaver had just got the wrong end of the stick somehow.

What else stood out to you about this chapter? What did you like? What did you dislike?

What stood out to me: the fact that Mr. Beaver says that when the Pevensies sit on the four thrones of Cair Paravel, that it will not only be the end of the White Witch's reign but of her life. Being someone who has studied the are-the-White-Witch-and-the-LotGK-the-same-person debate quite extensively, I made a note of that part. What I liked best: Mr. Beaver's warning about things that say they're human but aren't. What I liked the least: Edmund asking if the White Witch could turn Aslan into stone!

[Ryadian]

Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?
It's hard to discuss this without bringing the other books into this, so I'm going to be safe and spoiler box everything.

SHOW SPOILER "The later books"

I agree that it could have been a centaur or a dryad, since both have been associated with prophecy in the past, but... what about Aslan himself? In TMN, he prophesies that the Witch will return eventually; who's to say that he didn't also give the Narnians these prophecies to give them hope during the Witch's reign?

Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?
In addition to Peter's adventurous spirit, which we have seen elsewhere in the book, by that point Mr. Beaver has made it clear that the Pevensies won't be able to save Mr. Tumnus--or protect themselves--without Aslan's help. At that point, Peter may have decided that finding out what this Aslan could do, and finding out why his name alone filled him with such vigor, was worth the risks of meeting a lion.

What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?
Something safe is predictable, controllable, secure. It won't act wild, it will never do something you don't want, you will never have to fear it. Aslan is none of that. But, he is good, so you can trust that he will not do evil; he will not do harm without just cause.

What else stood out to you about this chapter? What did you like? What did you dislike?
One thing I really like about this chapter is that, like the children and the Beavers themselves, you don't notice when Edmund vanishes. You're so wrapped up in what Mr. Beaver is telling them (you) that you don't even notice when Edmund, who has been a key factor of these past few chapters, simply disappears from the narrative--until the time for the reveal, that is.

[Movie Aristotle]

Who do you think gave the prophecies about Aslan and four humans?

Likely two or three different people. I would suppose that the four thrones were built before the Witch's reign, since the saying about two Sons of Adam and two Daughters of Eve has been a saying in Narnia "time out of mind." Since Jadis was known to King Frank, the thrones, and the prophesy concerning them, might have been built at the same time as the construction of Cair Paravel itself.

If the four thrones and the prophesy were not from the same time period, then the thrones must have been constructed first, and the prophesy then likely came after Jadis began to rule, though not too long after since she only reigned for 100 years. Since I would hesitate to call a hundred years "time out of mind," I actually think the first scenario is more probable.

The prophesy "When Adam's flesh" I would imagine is even later than the prophesy from "time out of mind." I'd guess it was from the last good monarch of Narnia before the hundred year winter, foreseeing that care for the tree of protection would wain, but the rhyme could also have been from a time during the witch's reign.

The "Wrong will be right" prophesy does not seem like an early one, so, like "When Adam's flesh," I'd place this one later than year 204, though it could be as late as 950. (I'd hesitate to call any rhyme less than 50 years as "old.") Unlike "When Adam's flesh," "Wrong will be right" need not have been prophesied after the construction of the four thrones.

Why do you think Peter longed to see Aslan even though he had never heard of Aslan before meeting Mr. Beaver?

I think it has to do with the effect the name of Aslan had on Peter. Peter was feeling brave and adventurous, and it was Aslan's name that made him feel that way. How much more would he feel that way after meeting the name's bearer?

What does it mean that Aslan isn't safe but he is good?

He could do anything. He could ask you to do things that are unsafe, but are still the right things to do.

Now that we have gotten to know the Beavers, what are their strongest attributes? What are their weakest attributes? Do they balance each other out? If so, how?

I think both beavers are very practical, but in complimentary ways. Mr. Beaver has his eye on the big picture, Mrs. Beaver on the specifics.

They are the earthy, country, common-sense type folk who are humble but do what they can and become heroes in the process.