Writer's World

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Re: Writer's World

Postby FencerforJesus » Jun 17, 2012 2:55 pm

I don't think having an account there is an issue. Let me clarify. It's self-publishing the SAME BOOK as the one you are trying to propose that is the issue they have. Having an account there is not an issue. Likewise, the same author could have several books by different publishers and not have an issue. Publishers just don't want the same book published by two different publishers.

For my book, I'm going to have to make some changes and especially the title. They don't want readers doing a search on-line for a book and have two books with the same title by the same author by two different publishers. It leads to confusion and that's not good for business.

I think Kinkos can, but it's not going to be like a traditional novel. I have a friend who did it at Kinkos. It looks a little cheesy but might work for what you are trying to do. You can ask.
Be watching for the release of my spiritual warfare novel under a new title: "Call to Arms" by OakTara Publishing. A sequel (title TBD) will shortly follow.
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Ithilwen » Jun 17, 2012 3:54 pm

Thanks for the information, Fencer. :)

Meltintalle wrote:Ithilwen, by making your own, do you mean something like this? (I think the easiest way to start would be to focus on Coptic stitch variants)

I'm not sure... I don't quite know what that is. ;))

What I mean by making my own is maybe buying some blank sheets which is the same/similar to the kind of sheets they use for paperback book covers; then design a cover on my computer and print it out on the sheets. Then print out my novel on page-size paper and... bound it all together somehow? I don't know how professionals bind books together. Do they use a certain kind of glue? I've heard of people who take books that have fallen apart and bind them back together so that they look new from the store again, but I don't know how they do it. If they can do it, though, I would think people would be able to use the same method to make their own books...


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Re: Writer's World

Postby Meltintalle » Jun 18, 2012 8:42 am

If only glue is involved, you'd be describing a perfect bound book which would probably be the most difficult finish to achieve at home. Coptic stitch refers to a method of sewing the pages together and can be done without special equipment. :)

Somewhere, I have a short story that I bound into its own book and I also have a draft of one of my other stories that I put together without a cover. I can take pictures if you'd like.
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Narnian_Archer » Jun 25, 2012 8:45 am

Hello, fellow writers!! It's been so long since my last post here (I honestly feel rather awkward peeking in now... :ymblushing: ). One of the main reasons I haven't been posting is because I haven't been writing. Recently I decided to start writing again, but it's been monumental challenge for me. The thing is, every time I start writing, I can't get over how dreadfully CORNY everything sounds....in my head the whole story is so epic, the scenes tense, romantic, or hillariously funny, but on paper it looks so insignificant, cheesy, and just...ugh! And I get confused sometimes, especially when trying to describe something, say, in a castle, because I don't know how to draw out an architectural blueprint of a medieval castle, much less completely create one from scratch in my head, so I have trouble describing certain scenes. I'm starting to feel more and more like I have to be a genius like Tolkein if I want to get anywhere in my writing, or at least just make everything sound decent. Any advice on poor, uneducated-in-fantasy-writing, completely unexperienced writers like me, who just can't get past the first two lines, much less the first page because of pure embarassment? (yes, I may have spelt that wrong - my computer doesn't have spell-check at the moment, and I always have trouble spelling that word.)
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Re: Writer's World

Postby FencerforJesus » Jun 25, 2012 12:40 pm

We talked about that in the "Square Peg Society" while at the Colorado Christian Writer's Conference last month. Just so you know the "Square Peg Society" is for those who write Christian Fiction but do NOT write the stereotypical "Amish Romance". Myself, Frank Peretti, Ted Decker are excellent candidates for what the Square Peg Society is for.

Anyway, one night, we discussed how to write fantasy characters and fantasy worlds. The two are almost the same process. When you develop a character (not necessarily in the story itself), you don't just describe physical appearance. You describe the setting, the job the character does, the clothing, the technology the character uses, the dialect or language the character speaks. Creating a world is just taking that process a step further. If you have one character, then describe someone that character would interact with. Keep that process going and in a short time, you have a society and a world.

When describing a setting, you don't have to have the full details. Describe your scene through the eyes of a character. Would that character take the time and look around at everything? Likely not. Unless your character is the type to be observant, you don't need everything. A knight marching through a castle hallway to deliver a message to the king or lord is not going to be looking at all the tapestries or the height of the ceiling and take notice of the arches in the doorway. A knight would only take notice of the height if he was really big and had to duck. When you go through a scene, walk it through with your character. What would he/she see? Write that down. If he/she doesn't see it, don't worry about it.

Another suggestion is that as a writer, your job is to tell a story. The devil is in the details as some say. Don't worry about details or consistency. You can fix that later. Focus on the story and the details will work themselves out.
Be watching for the release of my spiritual warfare novel under a new title: "Call to Arms" by OakTara Publishing. A sequel (title TBD) will shortly follow.
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Ithilwen » Jun 25, 2012 1:24 pm

FencerforJesus wrote:When describing a setting, you don't have to have the full details. Describe your scene through the eyes of a character. Would that character take the time and look around at everything? Likely not. Unless your character is the type to be observant, you don't need everything. A knight marching through a castle hallway to deliver a message to the king or lord is not going to be looking at all the tapestries or the height of the ceiling and take notice of the arches in the doorway. A knight would only take notice of the height if he was really big and had to duck. When you go through a scene, walk it through with your character. What would he/she see? Write that down. If he/she doesn't see it, don't worry about it.

What if the author isn't writing it in first person? I know it's possible to write a book through a character's eyes even in third person, but what if the author isn't using that method? What if he/she wants to write the book from an omniscient "audience" perspective rather than the character's perspective? The "audience" would see the tapestry and such...


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Re: Writer's World

Postby FencerforJesus » Jun 25, 2012 2:14 pm

That was just one technique. But if you are going from an 'omniscient' POV (as though you are watching a movie), it's still the same process. Instead of the 'camera' coming from a character's eyes, it's coming from 'above' our 'from a distance'. Think about a movie camera. What can the camera see? An omniscient view just moves the camera away from a character and grabs the full view. The omniscient camera can pan and turn where a character's camera cannot. But it's still the same process.
Be watching for the release of my spiritual warfare novel under a new title: "Call to Arms" by OakTara Publishing. A sequel (title TBD) will shortly follow.
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Ithilwen » Jun 25, 2012 2:48 pm

FencerforJesus wrote:That was just one technique. But if you are going from an 'omniscient' POV (as though you are watching a movie), it's still the same process. Instead of the 'camera' coming from a character's eyes, it's coming from 'above' our 'from a distance'. Think about a movie camera. What can the camera see? An omniscient view just moves the camera away from a character and grabs the full view. The omniscient camera can pan and turn where a character's camera cannot. But it's still the same process.

Interesting. Though, I'm not sure I quite understand. What would be an example of something a camera can't see? Something you wouldn't want to put in your book if you were writing from an omniscient POV?


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Re: Writer's World

Postby Lady Courage » Jun 25, 2012 5:23 pm

Ithilwen wrote:Interesting. Though, I'm not sure I quite understand. What would be an example of something a camera can't see? Something you wouldn't want to put in your book if you were writing from an omniscient POV?


Well, if you're going with the idea of the knight going down the hallway, first imagine where the camera is. Is it in his head, hearing his thoughts, looking through his eyes? Well, since he's intent on his mission, he's probably looking straight ahead. The gloriously painted ceiling is not something he's even noticing right now. The length of the hallway, on the other hand, is something he's very much noticing. The crack in the floor he almost tripped over is something he's noticing. The slightly dank atmosphere he's noticing.

But is the camera floating around his body, LOTR Messenger-to-the-King style? You might get a whole ambiance shot of the painted ceiling, the acoustic properties of the hall, the grand marble tiles, the faded tapestries on the wall. But then again, you might only get a very brief glimpse of those because the Knight and his mission is the important part of the scene. You might only get enough time to describe his tattered cloak, dented armor and dirt streaked face before he bursts into the King's counsel chamber.

Going to LOTR again, Tolkien actually did a really good job with POV when he settles into character interaction and isn't describing the scenery (which he does beyond any rational human's capabilities lol) or giving the current battle overview anymore. Try studying how in Morder, we see almost exclusively through Sam's eyes. Sometimes, out of necessity (because Frodo doesn't tell what he sees sometimes), he slips into Frodo's view, but that never lasts long. Most of what goes through Frodo's head is unknown to us, except that Sam can read him very well.
In Gondor, we see almost exclusively through Pippin's eyes, again after the current battle has been shown us through the hovering cameras above the battlefield. Much of what we know about the state of the other characters is through little Pippin's eyes. We fearfully learn, along with Pippin, of Denethor's madness. We got a few hints as to why he's mad, thanks to Tolkien's flashback, but we see the same thing Pippin sees.
One of my favorite POV shifts in the whole book is when we go through the Paths of the Dead, and we go to Gimli's "camera". Seeing the ambiance of the mountain, feeling the petrifying fear and watching Aragorn turn a little more into King Ellesar through Gimli's eyes is lots of fun. We would have seen something entirely different if we'd seen it through Legolas's eyes, and I have a feeling we wouldn't relate to it half as well as we do Gimli's.

I know of a few short fanfics off the top of my head that do a good job with POV as well, but they are for Bonanza. :P If you'd like to see them, just PM me and I'll find and send you the links. ;)

EDITED TO ADD AN OFF TOPIC BUT EXCITING SOMETHING I JUST FOUND:

Ithy, you were asking about getting a "pro" copy of a book without an ISBN number?

http://www.blurb.com/

This place will NOT get you an ISBN, you have to do it yourself. And it's optional. \:D/
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Re: Writer's World

Postby 7chronicles » Jun 30, 2012 10:53 pm

Thanks for the advice on POV FencerforJesus! I didn't think of it that way before. :)
I finally, after a year and a half, got my new computer and have started to get all my writing and notes together! :D
I'm so happy! I bought this program called Scrivener, it's for writers and it is really helpful in organizing and writing. :)
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Re: Writer's World

Postby FencerforJesus » Jul 01, 2012 2:36 pm

I've submitted my manuscript for my spiritual warfare novel to Oak Tara Publishers. Now it's a 3-4 month (or less) waiting game to see if they want to take it. Oak Tara can market to Barnes and Nobel as well as Christian Book Distributors, where I currently cannot reach. My hold up on my sequel right now is job applications now that my teaching certificate was posted this past week.
Be watching for the release of my spiritual warfare novel under a new title: "Call to Arms" by OakTara Publishing. A sequel (title TBD) will shortly follow.
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Menelve » Jul 09, 2012 9:32 pm

Ithil, for descriptions I think everyone's given a whole load of wonderful advice. Personally I try to follow two rules.

1) Don't put in unimportant details.

For example. In that hallway LC was using, scene description of perhaps the ceiling or the wall decorations would only be relevant if it sets the mood or interacts with the character thereby making it an important detail. JK Rowling is a master at this.

2) Since I write mostly 1st person I try to describe the room as the character interacts with it.

This serves two purposes. One, it describes the room and two it provides action interspersed with the dialogue. This can still be used in other POVs. It's the difference between the knight in the above example noticing the crack in the floor from the moment he entered the hallway versus discovering it with his foot and perhaps freezing for a moment with the pain of a stubbed toe. The latter is much more interesting than saying "Halfway down the hall a crack split the floor in two".

Fencer, good luck with both the novel and the job applications. :)

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Re: Writer's World

Postby Lady Courage » Jul 10, 2012 1:23 pm

Oh, great tips Menelve! Funny, but I just got this article in my inbox and it basically just expounds on what you just said! lol

So, on subject... Previously mentioned article on imagery is awesome. :D
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Re: Writer's World

Postby Ithilwen » Jul 10, 2012 2:17 pm

Lady Courage wrote:So, on subject... Previously mentioned article on imagery is awesome. :D

That article confused me. /:) I don't see any difference between the sentences they use as an example of what's right, and the sentence at the end which they say is wrong. :-\

It makes sense in the first examples, because the first examples of what's wrong takes the focus off the characters entirely and just has the narrator describe the scenery without any regard to character perspective. Then it makes a good comparison by showing a better way of doing it - incorporating the characters and their viewpoint.

But when it reaches the last example:

The ancient floorboards creaked beneath her cold, bare feet as she paced the room apprehensively.

^^ That incorporates the characters just like their positive examples do. But it's used as an example of what not to do... :-\ I don't see too much wrong with that sentence (although I would remove the word "apprehensively" :P ).

On a side note:

The pine limbs now bent like those of a Christmas tree. A fresh breeze chilled her skin.
“Bill,” she whispered. “Speak to me...speak to me, Bill.”
But he did not. All she could hear was snorting and thrashing. She put a hand to her mouth. She thought she might scream but nothing came out of her mouth. Fear of attracting the bear kept her quiet. The pitch on her hand glued her lips shut.

In this example meant to show the correct way of doing descriptions, why would they think it's a good idea to compare something with a Christmas tree, when the focus of the moment is a nearby bear and a friend dead/unconscious? ;)) :P



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Re: Writer's World

Postby wild rose » Aug 03, 2012 2:59 am

I have to admit, editing is a tedious task, and it tends to give me a bit of a headache :p Though I am doing August CampNaNo, I am still faithfully editing my NaNo novel every day. I have a couple of people nipping at my heels to get Dragon Eyes finished, so I edit a little every day and hope to have the second draft competed by mid August and around the beginning of September have it fully completed :)
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Re: Writer's World

Postby FencerforJesus » Aug 03, 2012 1:28 pm

For about a month now, I've been staring at my half-way done revision of my sequel and I simply cannot get myself motivated to work on it. It's not writer's block because I know where it is supposed to go, but I just can't get myself to work on it. Very annoying.
Be watching for the release of my spiritual warfare novel under a new title: "Call to Arms" by OakTara Publishing. A sequel (title TBD) will shortly follow.
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