Chapter 7 - Old Narnia in Danger

[Pattertwigs Pal]

1. The Old Narnians are all very vocal with their opinions. What do you think of the way they interact with each other and Caspian?

2. Doctor Cornelius seems to know more about the history of the country and its magical places better than even the Talking Beasts. Why do you think this is?

3. What differences does Caspian see as he attends a Narnian council, from any Telmarine gathering?

4. How do you think the council came to be made up of only Caspian, Trumpkin, Nikabrik, Trufflehunter, and Dr Cornelius? If you were Caspian, who would you want on your council?

5. When trying to decide whether or not to use the horn, Caspian remarks that they can't be sure they are at their greatest need. (Dr. Cornelius tells Caspian that he should only use the horn in his greatest need when he gives it to him). Do you think there is some condition on the horn that it only works if one is in his greatest need or is it more of a warning to think before using it? Do you see any inconsistencies or plot holes between the way Father Christmas describes the horn when giving it to Susan and how it functions in Prince Caspian?

6. Which characterisation in this chapter appeals to you most?

7. Why is sunrise likely to "have an effect in cases of White Magic"?

8. What was your favorite part of this chapter?

[Ryadian]

1. The Old Narnians are all very vocal with their opinions. What do you think of the way they interact with each other and Caspian?
It's clear that most of the Narnians have respect for each other and Caspian, which is of course good. It's also clear that the Narnians don't really fear Caspian, which is also a good thing - to a degree. That is, until we get characters like Nikabrik and Trumpkin, who don't really hesitate to question Caspian's decisions. (Trumpkin has the presence of mind to only do this away from the rest of the army or under his breath, whereas Nikabrik has no such restraint.) Also, the Narnians are prone to turning on each other as well whenever they disagree or are in a bad mood, as poor Wimbleweather found out. On the one hand, all this fits with Narnia's free spirit - to some degree, it's better to have these survivors feeling as though they can make their own minds known than to feel oppressed again. On the other hand, it makes for a very poor army.

2. Doctor Cornelius seems to know more about the history of the country and its magical places better than even the Talking Beasts. Why do you think this is?
Even though the Talking Beasts have faith and long memories, they don't have recorded histories - not like the Telmarines and Cornelius. Also, Cornelius has dedicated himself to the study of Old Narnia, whereas the Talking Beasts merely pass it down to each other through their daily lives. It makes sense that Cornelius would know more specific details than many of the Talking Beasts.

3. What differences does Caspian see as he attends a Narnian council, from any Telmarine gathering?
I think the utter disorder would be a big difference from what Caspian is used to. The Telmarines may not be the wisest bunch, but they at least seem to know how to settle down to business. Also, there's the fact that the Narnians are so free with their opinions and chatter - I get the feeling that Miraz wouldn't really tolerate that kind of thing in his own meetings.

4. How do you think the council came to be made up of only Caspian, Trumpkin, Nikabrik, Trufflehunter, and Dr Cornelius? If you were Caspian, who would you want on your council?
Well, since Caspian is the king that the Narnians are following, it makes sense that he would be allowed to choose his own council, and why not choose the people he's known and trusted the longest? I'm a little surprised that Glenstorm isn't on the council, given his wisdom, but perhaps he had other duties. Regardless, for the most part, this council is also made up of the wisest and most level-headed old Narnians - as much as we love Reepicheep, he would've made for a poor member of this council! The exception there, of course, is Nikabrik, but imagine the kind of trouble he would've caused if he weren't there to "represent" the Dwarfs.

5. When trying to decide whether or not to use the horn, Caspian remarks that they can't be sure they are at their greatest need. (Dr. Cornelius tells Caspian that he should only use the horn in his greatest need when he gives it to him). Do you think there is some condition on the horn that it only works if one is in his greatest need or is it more of a warning to think before using it? Do you see any inconsistencies or plot holes between the way Father Christmas describes the horn when giving it to Susan and how it functions in Prince Caspian?
I think it's more of a warning to think before using it. It is, after all, a tool, not a toy - and an item of powerful magic. You would want to discourage those who believe in it enough to actually use it from using it on a whim. I am curious as to whether or not it would have actually worked much earlier in the story, such as, oh... when Caspian was running from the Telmarines and ran into the old Narnians.... (Okay, I'm sorry. Sort of. ) Also, there's the fact that, as Cornelius points out, the most likely way the horn will bring them help is to summon it, likely in the form of heroes or Aslan himself. You'd really only want to summon such heroes for a situation that demands them.

7. Why is sunrise likely to "have an effect in cases of White Magic"?
Well, there is a sense of hopefulness that's associated with the sunrise, which likely contributed to it. Also, the sun rises in the East, which has been associated with Aslan - the ultimate symbol of good magic.

8. What was your favorite part of this chapter?
I think when Trumpkin declares that he'll be the other messenger. Despite his clear disbelief in the horn and its properties, he's willing to go on the mission, because his King says that this is important and someone needs to do it. He's probably fully expecting to make it there and back and find nothing of use at all, assuming he makes it there and back, but decides to go after it anyways.

Not my favorite part of the chapter, but something that I tend to gloss over in this chapter that struck me this time is what happened with Wimbleweather, and it makes me kind of sad. The poor giant was just trying to help, but he ended up messing things up, both before and after the battle. Granted, the book only describes wounds that were suffered instead of deaths, but you still have to feel for the poor guy. Especially since, frankly, you can't really just blame him - none of the other Narnians nor Caspian really knew that Wimbleweather was likely to do that, but they should've considered some way to make sure that Wimbleweather only came out at the right time. Again, this army is made up of good intentions, but it takes more than that to win a war.

[aileth]

It's funny, but somehow I had always thought that the Great Council was held immediately, the same night they got to the Dancing Lawn. We aren't told how many days it was, but it wasn't right away.

1. The Old Narnians are all very vocal with their opinions. What do you think of the way they interact with each other and Caspian?
They are quite free and easy, not at all hesitant to speak up, or squash someone else when they disagree. But in the end, I think it is all summed up by Trumpkin's statement, reminiscent of the centurion in Matthew, "I know the difference between giving advice and taking orders. You've had my advice, and now it's the time for orders."

2. Doctor Cornelius seems to know more about the history of the country and its magical places better than even the Talking Beasts. Why do you think this is?
He was a scholar and seems to have made a life-long study of the subject--makes you wonder what else he knew?--whereas the Narnians were living more in the present. The small animals at least were not likely to have travelled great distances in their regular lives, so wouldn't have seen the places themselves.

A friend of mine was taking her citizenship test just recently, and we were discussing the fact that she probably knows more about Canadian history than a good number of home-born Canadians would. Perhaps that was the case here also.

3. What differences does Caspian see as he attends a Narnian council, from any Telmarine gathering?
A Telmarine gathering would not have been an opportunity for feasting, would it? Nor would there have been a diversity of creatures. One also gets the impression (without having attended one myself) that Miraz would not have brooked any criticism or contradiction. Look what happened to all those lords who didn't toe the line.

4. How do you think the council came to be made up of only Caspian, Trumpkin, Nikabrik, Trufflehunter, and Dr Cornelius? If you were Caspian, who would you want on your council?
Too many advisors spoil the broth? If you consider what a stramash the Great Council was (a lovely one, of course, but rather disorganized), it's not surprising that Caspian would tend to exclude the flighty members of his army. And those present were all known to be steady and practical, even if Nikabrik was a perpetual wet blanket. Maybe I would add a centaur or two; otherwise, I think he made a good choice.

5. When trying to decide whether or not to use the horn, Caspian remarks that they can't be sure they are at their greatest need. (Dr. Cornelius tells Caspian that he should only use the horn in his greatest need when he gives it to him). Do you think there is some condition on the horn that it only works if one is in his greatest need or is it more of a warning to think before using it? Do you see any inconsistencies or plot holes between the way Father Christmas describes the horn when giving it to Susan and how it functions in Prince Caspian?
It wasn't necessarily that it wouldn't have worked, had they blown it sooner, but more perhaps a case of them not knowing whether it would work more than once. Caspian was afraid of that, though where he acquired that idea, it is hard to say. After all, the horn had achieved legendary status, and who knows what stories were told of it? Father Christmas's instructions had not been passed down verbatim, I'm sure.

6. Which characterisation in this chapter appeals to you most?
Caspian's growth into kingship--"he began already to harden and his face wore a kinglier look." He had started to take on the responsibility of making decisions, as was demonstrated when Cornelius joined them. He didn't wait for someone else to suggest a course of action.

7. Why is sunrise likely to "have an effect in cases of White Magic"?
Remember Eustace and Jill in SC

SHOW SPOILER

facing to the east and calling to Aslan?

It wasn't needed, of course, in their case, but there is the same idea mentioned here. The appearance of light, and the consequent driving away of darkness? To say anything more would be getting ahead of the chapter.

8. What was your favorite part of this chapter?
The Wimbleweather bits, hands down:

"...a small but genuine Giant, Wimbleweather of Deadman's Hill, carrying on his back a basketful of rather sea-sick Dwarfs who had accepted his offer of a lift and were now wishing they had walked instead."

Or the bit where he was crying after having spoiled the battle, and the reaction of the mice.

[Pattertwigs Pal]

1. The Old Narnians are all very vocal with their opinions. What do you think of the way they interact with each other and Caspian?
It reflects the characteristics of their species. They would likely have had great difficulty reaching a decision without clear leadership. I find their differing ideas very amusing.
2. Doctor Cornelius seems to know more about the history of the country and its magical places better than even the Talking Beasts. Why do you think this is?
The talking beasts likely focused on remembering the stories, focused on events and the characters. They would have known of the stone table but not remembered the How. Doctor Cornelius was a scholar so he would try to learn all aspects of the history.
3. What differences does Caspian see as he attends a Narnian council, from any Telmarine gathering?
I'm sure the Narnian council is much more open. People would be allowed to free express their opinions.
4. How do you think the council came to be made up of only Caspian, Trumpkin, Nikabrik, Trufflehunter, and Dr Cornelius? If you were Caspian, who would you want on your council? I think Caspian chose the Narnians he had known the longest and then Dr. Cornelius because he was his tutor and guide. I would have wanted Glenstorm on my council.

5. When trying to decide whether or not to use the horn, Caspian remarks that they can't be sure they are at their greatest need. (Dr. Cornelius tells Caspian that he should only use the horn in his greatest need when he gives it to him). Do you think there is some condition on the horn that it only works if one is in his greatest need or is it more of a warning to think before using it? Do you see any inconsistencies or plot holes between the way Father Christmas describes the horn when giving it to Susan and how it functions in Prince Caspian?
I think the horn would work whether it was the greatest need or only a great need so it was more of a warning. I do not see any inconsistencies or plot holes - Father Christmas seemed not to fully know the power of the horn and I don't find it hard to believe that over time it could take on the power to bring back its owner.

6. Which characterisation in this chapter appeals to you most?
Either the mice or Pattertwig
7. Why is sunrise likely to "have an effect in cases of White Magic"?
It is a time of hope for the new day. The darkness is starting to fade.
8. What was your favorite part of this chapter?
Pattertwig running around trying to get everyone quiet while they are trying to get him to stop.