Susan vs. Lilliandil

[LittleLionTamer]

Yes, in the books. But this to me looks like a very movie-verse discussion so we need to leave the books out there, because Caspian and Susan never had something there. And I'm talking about people who do NOT know the books and I know many. They only have seen the movies and to them, it's not clear which role Lilliandil holds except of being a star and telling them that Dark Island is evil. In the books, yes. But in the books Lilliandil was just a girl with a star as father and in the books it has been stated that they got married. And I must ask you, if you didn't know the books - what would you think? Would it be clear for you that they got married in the end? Caspian didn't even mention her anymore. He at least could have said something like "I'm going to find Lilliandil now", just to show the audience that he's interested still. When I told my friends who watched the movie with me that the Star is supposed to be Caspians wife, they looked at me like this: O_O
So yeah. We all have to be a bit open minded there. It leaves many plots open but to me it doesn't look like it has a clear plot towards Caspiandil. And I don't wanna hear that they are married in the books now, because I know that. But the bookversion is not Caspiandil to me. It stays to me Caspian/Ramandu's Daughter.

[wild rose]

Caspian didn't even mention her anymore. He at least could have said something like "I'm going to find Lilliandil now", just to show the audience that he's interested still. When I told my friends who watched the movie with me that the Star is supposed to be Caspians wife, they looked at me like this: O_O

haha that is the same reaction that I got from a lot of my friends (by the way, welcome to Narniaweb LittleLionTamer it's so wonderful to have you)

In my personal opinion the romance in the movie VDT was simply not a romance, I'm not sure what it was, but it sure didn't seem like romance too me. After the meeting with her on Ramndu's Island Caspian NEVER ONCE mentions Lilliandil, in the book we have Lucy reminding Caspian of his promise to return to the island, and Caspian goes "right then there's that" implying that he still remembers Lilliandil and wants to return and get to know her.....but in the movie.....they could at least have had one line, after he already left the island, to sort of have us know that he is falling in love with her. Maybe he is thinking about her all the time, but we can't see what is going on in his head. I really liked the way the Suspian romance was played out and I actually liked the fact that it was there, I though it added a bit to the story. I don't support that Susan and Caspian were forever meant for each other. I like to think of Susan as Caspian's first teenage crush, something most of us have, not true love, not forever, but still I liked it. While with Caspian and Lilliandil, I like to think of them as meant for each other, like Caspian searching for a long time for the right woman, and at last finding her, and I was slightly dissapointed when it seemed to me they simply took it out of the movie I was also quite upset that they made her a star, I thought looked like they were trying to copy "Star Dust".......maybe it's just me Is there anyone else here who doesn't like the fact that they made her a star, instead of the daughter of a star (I know that maybe being the daughter of a star makes you a star, but when I read the book, somehow I got the impression that she wasn't a star, again I don't know, maybe it's just me )

[Rilians Queen]

littleLionTamer, just out of curiosity but don't you like The little mermaid and Beauty and the Beast. It's the same thing with Caspian and lilliandil, especially The little Mermaid. I can just see Lilliandil now bursting into song "Part of your world"

Anyways I personally thought that Suspian had lots of moments but I have to agree to me it didn't feel like a real romance it more like a heat of the moment infatuation between two teenagers. I will admit I don't really care too much for Suspian like I used to but that scene where Caspian rescues Susan makes me blush everytime i see it sometimes. But the romance could have been better if there was story between the two but like what someone previously stated it wasn't, therefore I don't care about Suspian.

There could have been more Caspian and Lilliandil moments if the crew had tried. Like DamselJillPole's lovely signature, I feel her face should have came up in the wave like that remembering that he wants to meet her again and have audiences see this again that he is thinking about her. Though I will admit again Caspian did look serious about meeting Lilliandil again and if the audience chooses to get a different reaction from that then I'm sorry, they are blind. The chemistry was deffinitely there. I just wished more was done about them.

[QueenSusan03]

I watched the movie about 3 times now and I have to vote for Susan. I hated Caspain and Susan. I thought the idea wasn't smart from any part of the crew. When i found out about the romance, I was like, "What made the writers think Caspian had a chance with Queen Susan?" but when I watched PC, I thought it was ok. Nothing big...he did find her atractive though. Words DO NOT NEED TO BE SAID IN ORDER FOR A MAN OR WOMAN 2 SAY SOMEONE IS BEAUTIFUL!!!. Just because a man says you're pretty does not mean he's in love and is willingly to die for you!!!!!!!!

I have grown up with these books since I was little and now I just turned 21 this month. I respect everyone here and their thoughts but I didn't agree (I HATED caspain and lilliandil or whatever was her name in the movie. in the book it's much more subtle. I see comments in some saything that the movie throws it in your face that they are in love. I DID NOT SEE IT THAT WAY! He 'loves' her because she could fly, she is not human, she glows(she's going to blind him in certian activities), (I might get kicked out for that but true), and is insanly pretty to him. His eyes like what they see rather nothing more.

I understand some others say that their is a more 'adult' feeling to caspiandil but how can someone fall in love in the matter of 6 min? I can't. Remember Caspian and Susan were teenagers in PC. Of course they were going to have the teenage romance! When there is attraction between 2 people, it always starts out with flirting. YOu look here, he looks there, you blush, he blushes, you give each other the EYE. Even with adults its how it begins. I thought it sweet and we did get closure from them. I felt like lilliandil was over done. Apt really went out of his way this time. =-( they really tried to hard to 'promote' caspian and lilliandil till the point i might've vomitted. she was too blue. Too much graciousness and that bow! Oh my gosh! When they bowed, I was just like ok they took the methaphor in the book WAY too seriously. the actress was pretty but it didn't cut it for me.

I watch PGuddle and Rillian on youtube and Rillian had mentioned about RD saying she'll transform herself, I laughed that moment cause I agreed with him about 'whoever knew rd was a shapshifter" honestly, i was laughing because i thought same at the Theaters! But besides the point caspian and lilliandil were a bit... Convenient-at least for caspian beause susan will never return and the star girl is pretty-THAT'S IT. when I saw that I couldn't believe that line was in there! I was shocked! One it shows that rd knows she's hot but because it's disturbing to Caspian and Edmund she'll change herself. All I could thin about it how concieted that line was. remember caspian is a 20 yr old guy-rd is about his age and pretty-of course he was gonna feel sexual feelings for her-like with Susan. when there is attraction there is physical too you know...they made it look like he liked her and then when he says goodbye, he'll court her first and then marry her. The writers did not try with them but with the one line about Susan, they had done it with Susan. With that one line, the writers gave more credit to Susan.

Some mention about Caspain telling rd that she is 'most beautiful." and that he didn't say such things to Susan. One, Susan is the MOST famous queens of Narnia. Remeber that she is a myth and legend. Caspain would not dare to say that to her because it medieval mythogoly it's a rude to just say something like that out loud. With no care. His actions said enough about his feelings for her. When he saves her it keeps volume about how he felt. He rather go and save Susan then to stay behind and watch the fight go on with Peter and his uncle Miraz-THE man who murdered his father! Two, when Susan cautions him throughout the movie, he listens-and only to her! Not Peter, who is the High king.

With rd, it's like for me at least in the movie it's done because it's in the book. YOu could tell that the writers didn't want to dwell in that romance for long which was good because it was not the Point!! I was NEVER a Caspian and lilliandil fan, I began reading this books since I was 10. Caspain and lilliandil or Rd, in book it too seemed a little off. My reason is because C.S, wrote the books based somewhat on his personal eperiences in life. And Rd is C.S. wife in the life, and a figure of his ideal woman would be. We are reading about his life...especailly when it comes to caspiandil. Like I said she is the figure of his wife. Rd's death was inspired by C.S.'s wife's death. C.S., wife died of cancer within 3 years of their marriage. And it was not expected like rd's death in SC. The cancer was the posion that invaded C.S.'s wife-like Rd, the posoin of the snake was what killed her. So maybe that's why I didn't feel a connection with Caspaindil because it was based on C.S.'s life. When it comes to these things, I never feel a personal connection since I was 10 and I still don't. Not even the movie helped me which I hoped it would've. So I felt like I was reading C.S.'s life and marriage rather than Caspain-the character. I understand C.S. had been through many difficulties in his life-especially with woman but his life got in the way of caspian's. He entiwined them a bit too much.


again I do apologize to RD fans but I just didn't like it! I was leaning more towards Caspain and Lucy because there was somthing going between them in the book and I would've not have gotten mad if they've done a romance with Lucy and Caspian but Ben Barnes in almost 30 and Georgie is like 14, 15? Yeah, not right. C.S. himsef points out in VERY subtle way that Lucy was Caspian's mate but she had to come back home and it wouldn't be fair if she stayed while the others were forced back to earth. I won't mention the part but it's with Lord Rhoop, around that chapter. It got me thinking, "Why Lucy and not Rd, if she is the "supposed" love of his life?" C.S. is saything something there-you will only see it and understand it if you read it with an open mind. Don't go looking for it!

In the end Caspian didn't want to go back to Rd, he yeared to go with Reepichep. And if you read the SC chair, it hinted that Caspian had never for gotten the VTD. His death wish was to see earth, and man who was so depressed not want to see Rd for one last time? That was Caspain's true heart's desire-not RD. and the writer's took that out of the movie. Apt understood the gravity of the scene. It was an inslut to RD.

I too heard about caspain having flashbacks of Rd in SC but that is not the point of the book! yes it is a side plot but the writers NEVER think about what the americans. us americans DO NOT like watching a person mourn another for 2 HOURS! that it why these movie don't do well here in America. And yet another caspian movie! Sc will be the downfall of the series. and i see that apt sees that too. Thank god that they are making MN now, i hope so. Finally back to the world of Narnia of old. finally a movie that could make bank for FOX studios. I had enough with Caspian and his life! I love the books to death but just watching him is already making my head spin. TOO MUCH of CASPIAN! My friends too, some didn't read the books, but are too, tired of seeing Ben Barnes. Maybe they will make the movies that are likely to make more money and then ones that won't make so much.

ending, I vote for Caspian and Susan. I suggest you watch the kiss scene a little closer and see what caspain does to Susan. Look at his hand gesture when she departs and goes to stand by lucy. on the side note, some say that caspain does things for lilliandil that he never did for Susan. anderson had to delete MANY of the scenes between Suspain because of us narnian purtist. Remember that caspiandil fans. So we may never know what truly went on between them or what was said and done. because of us complaining, we do not get the opportunity to see what happened-truly happened. SO we really DO NOT have the right to compare or judge. Only those couple scenes Suspain had is all we will ever get besides a deleted Archery scene. or the picture in google of them together after he saves her and Anna is resting her chin on his shoulder while he talks to her with a smile.

I hope that for SC, I HOPE they do not to flashbacks because its bad enough they copied LOTR but to do it again of caspian having flashbacks of lilliandil like Aragon has with Arwen. Again, I am sorry to say this but if they don't get better writers, SC will not make it big here in America. The only thing saving the series in here US, is the release date on Christmas...HOW SAD...
Thank God, they are doing MN next! Finally a break! NOw let's just hope that they stick to it if they are looking for their money back.

[DamselJillPole]

I understand some others say that their is a more 'adult' feeling to caspiandil but how can someone fall in love in the matter of 6 min? I can't.

That's all it took with the current boyfriend i have now. It's something that people will just know if you are trully soulmates.

Some mention about Caspain telling rd that she is 'most beautiful." and that he didn't say such things to Susan. One, Susan is the MOST famous queens of Narnia. Remeber that she is a myth and legend. Caspain would not dare to say that to her because it medieval mythogoly it's a rude to just say something like that out loud. With no care. His actions said enough about his feelings for her.

True, but Caspian only did one thing for Susan when she prompted everything else. Not talking about the glances.

With rd, it's like for me at least in the movie it's done because it's in the book. YOu could tell that the writers didn't want to dwell in that romance for long which was good because it was not the Point!! I was NEVER a Caspian and lilliandil fan, I began reading this books since I was 10. Caspain and lilliandil or Rd, in book it too seemed a little off. My reason is because C.S, wrote the books based somewhat on his personal eperiences in life. And Rd is C.S. wife in the life, and a figure of his ideal woman would be. We are reading about his life...especailly when it comes to caspiandil. Like I said she is the figure of his wife. Rd's death was inspired by C.S.'s wife's death. C.S., wife died of cancer within 3 years of their marriage. And it was not expected like rd's death in SC. The cancer was the posion that invaded C.S.'s wife-like Rd, the posoin of the snake was what killed her. So maybe that's why I didn't feel a connection with Caspaindil because it was based on C.S.'s life. When it comes to these things, I never feel a personal connection since I was 10 and I still don't. Not even the movie helped me which I hoped it would've. So I felt like I was reading C.S.'s life and marriage rather than Caspain-the character. I understand C.S. had been through many difficulties in his life-especially with woman but his life got in the way of caspian's. He entiwined them a bit too much.

I too see a few things in Caspian's character that does relate to CS Lewis's real life but "Joy" CS Lewis's wife had not died yet when CS was working on VDT. And that's the point of writers. The best writers out there ever write about their experiences. Basically every book you read and every movie you watch the writer always writes from their experience. Believe it or not but CS lewis based every single character on people he knew.

again I do apologize to RD fans but I just didn't like it! I was leaning more towards Caspain and Lucy because there was somthing going between them in the book and I would've not have gotten mad if they've done a romance with Lucy and Caspian but Ben Barnes in almost 30 and Georgie is like 14, 15? Yeah, not right. C.S. himsef points out in VERY subtle way that Lucy was Caspian's mate but she had to come back home and it wouldn't be fair if she stayed while the others were forced back to earth. I won't mention the part but it's with Lord Rhoop, around that chapter.

I'm sorry for this everyone but I do agree with this! When I was younger I too grew up with these stories ever since I was a baby and I'm 21 as well. I was always upset and never knew why CS didn't write Lucy with Caspian. I was very much a hardcore fan of Lucian and I still am. Also there are many movies where actors are very much younger then the other actor where they have to portray a romance storyline. Kristen Stewart was 15 or 16 in this film where she had a romance with an actor ten years older than her. So yes it does happen, and me coming from being on a lot of movie sets it's not illegal nor in the least romantic, it's a professional job.

Then again it is written that Caspian goes back to RD so they could not let Lucy and Caspian happen. Even though I wish but

In the end Caspian didn't want to go back to Rd, he yeared to go with Reepichep. And if you read the SC chair, it hinted that Caspian had never for gotten the VTD. His death wish was to see earth, and man who was so depressed not want to see Rd for one last time? That was Caspain's true heart's desire-not RD. and the writer's took that out of the movie. Apt understood the gravity of the scene. It was an inslut to RD.

Caspian knew he was dead and very close to Aslan's Country and he knew he was going to see RD again. In LB it is said that he was with her and Rilian so no I think he does love her and he did mourn her death in SC.

I too heard about caspain having flashbacks of Rd in SC but that is not the point of the book! yes it is a side plot but the writers NEVER think about what the americans. us americans DO NOT like watching a person mourn another for 2 HOURS! that it why these movie don't do well here in America. And yet another caspian movie! Sc will be the downfall of the series. and i see that apt sees that too. Thank god that they are making MN now, i hope so. Finally back to the world of Narnia of old. finally a movie that could make bank for FOX studios. I had enough with Caspian and his life! I love the books to death but just watching him is already making my head spin. TOO MUCH of CASPIAN! My friends too, some didn't read the books, but are too, tired of seeing Ben Barnes. Maybe they will make the movies that are likely to make more money and then ones that won't make so much.

I agreed with some but not everything, but your opinion stands nicely

ending, I vote for Caspian and Susan. I suggest you watch the kiss scene a little closer and see what caspain does to Susan. Look at his hand gesture when she departs and goes to stand by lucy. on the side note, some say that caspain does things for lilliandil that he never did for Susan. anderson had to delete MANY of the scenes between Suspain because of us narnian purtist. Remember that caspiandil fans. So we may never know what truly went on between them or what was said and done. because of us complaining, we do not get the opportunity to see what happened-truly happened. SO we really DO NOT have the right to compare or judge. Only those couple scenes Suspain had is all we will ever get besides a deleted Archery scene. or the picture in google of them together after he saves her and Anna is resting her chin on his shoulder while he talks to her with a smile.

You really scare me with this. But what was in the film between Caspian and Susan that i saw was mostly shy, attraction, and teenage infatuation. It was not a real romance to me, neither was Caspiandil I admit, but I know (and I don't care about anyone else) they will have one, even greater than Suspian.

I was one who said that Caspian and Lilliandil go through more than Caspian and Susan did (I don't care about the deleted scenes we're not seeing, it must not be anything shocking, it's a Disney film for goodness sake). I say this because Suspian lasted for a week or almost a week while Caspiandil lasted for more than a decade.

If you think about that it is true.

I hope that for SC, I HOPE they do not to flashbacks because its bad enough they copied LOTR but to do it again of caspian having flashbacks of lilliandil like Aragon has with Arwen. Again, I am sorry to say this but if they don't get better writers, SC will not make it big here in America. The only thing saving the series in here US, is the release date on Christmas...HOW SAD...
Thank God, they are doing MN next! Finally a break! NOw let's just hope that they stick to it if they are looking for their money back.

Unlike you when SC does come around I really hope that they do those flashbacks! I hate sitting around seeing Suspian getting more of the credit.

[Lucy of Narnia]

...Suspian lasted for a week or almost a week while Caspiandil lasted for more than a decade.

Actually, so far, Caspiandil is non existent to me. I am basing which one I like more on how the movies portray them, not the books. Which makes sense sense Suspian was not in the books. Caspiandil was barely.

So anyway, I think that yes, Caspian and Susan was an infatuation. But right now there is no Caspiandil, as far as I am concerned. Susan and Caspian spent some time together, Lilliandil and Caspian shared one conversation and he told her she was 'most beautiful'.

To me, Caspiandil fans are basically saying that a romance where someone looks at a picture of someone else could compete with a romance where the person also has a phone call with them- neither are great, but one is at least a little more 'existent'.

And if someone visiting America from another country said that I was good looking, then they left, I would most definitely NOT say that we had had a romance!!

My opinions.

Lu

[wild rose]

I agree Lucy of Narnia, the sad thing about the Caspiandil romance is that there is no romance, I'm not sure what it was, a conversation I guess with some cheesy lines, which was dissapointing for me cause I was hoping for more. Personally I didn't see anything wrong with the way Suspian was made, maybe it was kinda corny, but for goodness sake, their teenagers having a crush, it's bound to be corny (at least all mine were ). I thought they made it very well. Caspiandil.....what can I say, they kinda blew it, cause it is a little absent

[Elanor]

This is a great conversation - and I agree with a lot being said, especially by Queen Susan. And everyone seems to be keeping their temper too!
I've said this before, but here goes again . . There IS no romance between Caspian and Lilliandil in the movie. And there obviously is with Susan! That's just the basic, obvious thing.

I say this because Suspian lasted for a week or almost a week while Caspiandil lasted for more than a decade.

Once more - this is not a discussion about what happened in the whole series put together. It is talking about sections in two movies. Of course Caspiandil turned out to be a real romance, they got married, and like it was in the book, it's beautiful! But that DID NOT happen in the movie.

True, but Caspian only did one thing for Susan when she prompted everything else. Not talking about the glances.

Glances? I'm sorry - Love is not about feeling a desire for someone. Not about thinking someone is beautiful. Not about feeling somehow that this is your soul mate.
I do not think Caspian and Susan loved each other. But in the movie, Caspian and Lilliandil didn't come even close to anything of the sort.

And if someone visiting America from another country said that I was good looking, then they left, I would most definitely NOT say that we had had a romance!!

Well said!!

It was not a real romance to me, neither was Caspiandil I admit, but I know (and I don't care about anyone else) they will have one, even greater than Suspian.

That is perfectly true. Just in VDT, it didn't happen. That's the only point we're all trying to make!

[DamselJillPole]

You know coming to think of it. i really change my mind. im totally in love with suspian now. I watched Prince Caspian today and it's been two years since and while rewatching it i really saw something in Caspian and Susan that I really liked and felt i could relate to the romance like i do with my boyfriend. They were so cute!

I really wish I can change my vote to Suspian now.

EDIT: (April 2nd) Nah! April Fools Joke!! I still love my Caspian/Lilliandil and that will never change!

[Elanor]

But it wasn't April Fools day when you posted that?

[DamselJillPole]

It was 12;38 AM in my time zone! haha happy April Fools Day Elanor!

[Shastafan]

I think you guys are completely nuts. Neither Suspian or Caspianlilliandil are great. It's Caspian and Gael that worked the best. Couldn't you see how those two loved each other? Lilliandil and Susan obviously failed compared to Gael. Who agrees with me?

[Elanor]

Oh! Shastafan, this is unbelievable! Finally somebody came out and said what I've been too scared to even think - Cael!!!! I will admit, I've always secretly loved it, though I can't believe I'm saying this! So glad you agree!
(damsel, I keep seeing you and thinking you're Lover! )

[DamselJillPole]

lol! Ithilwen told me the same thing Elanor! It's actually what I wanted! Thank you!

Shastafan that is so funny but im more shipping toward Gael/Eustace

[Lucy of Narnia]

Oh, you guys are nuts! It was supposed to be Lucy and Eustace- they are not really cousins in the book, those movie people change everything!! Especially in chapter 35 the Lustace was SOOOO sweet!!
Ok, everyone knows this was APRIL FOOLS!!

[Kira]

Like most of you, I'm a definite supporter of Ramandu's daughter and Caspian, just like it's supposed to be. However, again I'll have to agree with the majority and say Suspian was better done in the movie, not Caspiandil.
It's funny, they ran so far with a romance that didn't even exist in the book, I thought they'd do way more and go totally overboard with the romance that actually is in the book. But no, they barely do anything with the real romance. What's with that?