Differences you actually want

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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Aslan Fan » Apr 14, 2014 5:14 pm

And don't forget the whole scene with Jill and the rest running from the Giants towards the Stone City. That could be juiced up without really adding much.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jun 04, 2014 4:19 pm

Something I've been wondering about lately is the bridge scene. Should/will the filmmakers make it more exciting?

The book says that some of the huge stones are missing, having fallen to foaming river below. Should someone slip and nearly fall through one? Further, the Lady of the Green Kirtle was quick to try to kill the questers by sending them to Harfang; should she do something to try to take their lives at the bridge as well? Perhaps an earthquake coming up from the depths of Underland that destroys the giant bridge just as the questers are crossing it? (They don't need it on the return trip, so it's somewhat expendable.)

Earlier in this thread, aileth talked about the possibility of Trumpkin sending out a search party to intercept and stop Puddleglum and the children, with the thought that they might turn back at the bridge because it would be too dangerous to go any further. Destroying the bridge could fit well with that idea.

It also occurs to me that crossing this bridge can't have been a very fun moment for Eustace. :P I kind of hope that, in the movie, he'll make a joke to Jill along the lines of not getting any ideas about trying to "murder" him again. ;))

Anyway, another thought I've been pondering recently is whether or not the Lady of the Green Kirtle and the Black Knight should be seen together in this scene, or at least in the same sense that we see them appear in the book.

I don't so much care whether or not the audience suspects Rilian's identity at the end of the movie; you'd have to jump through a lot of hoops to make that reveal a genuine twist. What I don't want is for the audience to feel like our heroes are dense because they aren't immediately suspicious that the woman in the green dress and the guy all covered up in armor are the exact people they've been sent to look for.

Hmmm, if you go with the idea of destroying the bridge... pardon me while I start imagining the possible scene in my head. ;))

After the questers have reached safety on the other side of the gorge, you could potentially have the Lady of the Green Kirtle appear, materializing out of the mist and approaching the three. Inwardly, she's seething that they thwarted her plan to do away with them, but the audience won't know this. She could express what appears to be genuine concern for the questers ("Some of you are young pilgrims to walk this rough waste"), and suggests that they go to Harfang.

Then, she sees the Black Knight riding toward them, and she stiffens and her demeanor visibly changes. She says that she must go, and after mounting the white horse and beginning to ride towards the Knight, she calls over her shoulder the final instructions about reaching Harfang before they lock the door. Mist then swirls around her retreating form and the more distant image of the Black Knight, and both disappear.

Now, if you're looking at this from the perspective of someone who doesn't know that the woman is evil, you'd probably think that it was the Black Knight who was in control of the Lady of the Green Kirtle, not the other way around. In reality, she looked worried upon seeing Rilian approach because she didn't want him to get close to the Narnians, and perhaps was even uncertain about the strength of the enchantment.

I would imagine that if you're able to establish the Black Knight as a Bad Guy in the minds of the audience, then people will be much more likely to think that Jill and Eustace have a point when they're arguing with Puddleglum over whether or not they should go to Harfang. Don't want movie-goers to throw their popcorn at the screen and shout "Don't do it!" :P Still, I don't want the filmmakers to change too much, either. It's a delicate balance. :-?

This post is ridiculously long. @-) My apologies. ;))
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Anfinwen » Jun 06, 2014 7:09 pm

Ooooooooh! I like the idea of trying to make the black knight look like a bad guy in the minds of unsuspecting viewers. What a brilliant idea, Rose-Tree Dryad! I've always thought that it was a little dense of the children and Puddleglum not to figure things out sooner, and that would really shake things up a bit.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Skilletdude » Jun 07, 2014 7:21 pm

Now that you mention it, it is peculiar that the Lady would even take him with her if this was a premeditated attack against the three travelers. You would think she would keep Rilian far away from any Narnian influence, especially considering that she went to great lengths to suppress his old memories.

Maybe the filmmakers could downplay his appearance by adding more armored forces to the group, maybe some leftover remnants of Telmar who are persuaded to join with the Witch to regain their power over Narnia. They could be seen with similar armored faces like we saw in PC. Puddleglum could tell Jill and Eustace, "I didn't like the look of those chaps, an awful lot like the kind we dealt with in the old days."

In fact, maybe the reason why the Lady could be above ground during this time is that she is trying to gather the scattered forces who are still loyal to Telmarine rule, and using the brainwashed Rilian to do so. Of course, this would be a large departure and could complicate the story too much. I guess there isn't a very good way to disguise this meeting as something casual, particularly because of the menacing knight by her side.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jun 08, 2014 12:38 pm

Thank you, Anfinwen! (Your new username is really pretty, by the way!)

Reading the book, I kind of get the impression that the encounter at the bridge may have been happenstance, Skilletdude. Enchanted Rilian says that the Lady of the Green Kirtle would often take him up to Overworld to go riding and let his eyes adjust to the sunlight, in preparation for invading Narnia.

The odds of them running into each other, though! Plus, it also seem that she would be the type to keep closer tabs on what's going on up above, especially considering the fact that "more than thirty champions" had gone looking for Rilian since his disappearance.

I guess it's also possible that she was just really certain about the strength of the enchantment. She thrives on psychological manipulation and seems like the type who would get a kick out of having Rilian look right at a marshwiggle and be unable to actually see it for what it was. It's just another feather in her cap.

That idea about Telmarine rebels is really interesting, though. I love the idea of utilizing those armored faces from PC again, even if only the gnomes wore them at one point. The thought of seeing the gnomes above ground, covered up in leftover Telmarine armor, skulking around and spying on the questers, looking human yet creepily not human... it seems like that could be cool and unnerving.

Still—it's a big departure from the book. :P Theoretically, though, if the film did have the gnomes appear above ground at any time, it would make sense that they would be covered up in some way, since their eyes and skin aren't used to sunlight and they also seem to have a fear of open spaces.

Even so, there's still the question of how the Lady of the Green Kirtle would know that these questers were on their way to the neighborhood, if she's going to be sending out minions to keep tabs on their progress into the North and give them trouble along the way. Maybe she could have a spy or a stooge sitting in on the Parliament of Owls? A bat, perhaps, hiding in the rafters of the ruined tower. The scene closing with the bat sneaking out of the tower, unseen, and flying off to the north could be a good visual.

I have way too many ideas. :))
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Skilletdude » Jun 08, 2014 7:28 pm

The Rose-Tree Dryad wrote:Enchanted Rilian says that the Lady of the Green Kirtle would often take him up to Overworld to go riding and let his eyes adjust to the sunlight, in preparation for invading Narnia.

Yes, that's right; I forgot that line. But it could benefit the film to make their chance encounter after the bridge less of a coincidence somehow. But on the other hand, I suppose Edmund bumping into the White Witch on his first exposure to Narnia was implausible too, and it didn't come off odd in the film.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jul 14, 2014 11:28 pm

A while ago on the NarniaWeb podcast (episode #102), they brought up the fact that Jill never once thinks about writing the signs down. (I had never considered that before, personally.) I can already see the parody videos for The Silver Chair touching upon this. Do you guys think that having Jill write down the signs would be a beneficial change, or would it hurt the film?

In some ways, I can imagine that having the signs written down could actually be used to drive home just how much Jill has forgotten about her task. In the scene where Jill, Eustace and Puddleglum are struggling to reach Harfang, I'm visualizing the paper with the signs written on it being blown out of a pocket and then flying away in the snowy wind without Jill even noticing. This would be very symbolic of Jill's frame of mind at this point in the film as well as the choice they are making here.

Then later, when she is having the dream with the rocking horse morphing into the Lion and she is suddenly overtaken with fear because she finds she can't remember the signs, she reaches for her pocket and finds that it's empty. This fills her with shame and horror, and reinforces the idea that she has completely forgotten them and neglected her duty. Further, if I recall correctly, Jill doesn't speak in the dream scene, so having her searching her pocket for a list that isn't there would give the audience a good idea of what is on her mind.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby aileth » Jul 15, 2014 9:25 am

I don't think it would lose anything by having her write down the signs. After missing the first one, she ought to be really anxious to not forget the rest. The whole point is that she gradually forgot them, stopped saying them over and over, particularly as the journey grew wearisome. You could have her pulling out the list now and again, and mumbling over the signs in a half-hearted manner. Then by the time they were in the snow storm she wouldn't even be doing that. It would give more impact to the dream, I would think.

It would be a good visual way of showing her failure to keep up her responsibilities, rather than saying multiple times, "Alas, I am undone! I have forgotten the signs!" (a la Walden VDT. Subtlety, subtlety!)
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby wolfloversk » Dec 29, 2014 2:48 am

I'd like to see them flesh out Rilian's back story more in the beginning of the story to make the audience want to see him rescued :P In the book he is introduced a bit late (from a film perspective). I think it'd be nice to start the film in Narnia... show his mother dying and him running off for the last time... then cut to the kids... bring them to Narnia and when Aslan explains he's missing the audience might have more of an emotional attachment to the quest itself. I think to it's preferable to a flashback during the parliment of owls or simply them talking when it comes to cinematically explaining Rilian's back story.

Would the movie work without that? Yes. Would I vehemently protest if they did that? No. :P
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