Differences you actually want

Talk about any aspect of the films.

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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Skilletdude » Jan 18, 2014 2:05 pm

The Rose-Tree Dryad wrote:I really wouldn't expect Hollywood not to expand it to some degree, but if they turn it into a thirty minutes-long fighting spectacular, I will not be very happy. :P


I don't think we'll need to worry too much about that. This film will undoubtedly receive a decreased budget than the previous films, which may turn out well. It forces them to show restraint. ;)
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby aileth » Jan 21, 2014 11:29 pm

One thing I wouldn't mind seeing, which didn't happen in the book, but was suggested in it, would be for Trumpkin to hear about their plans and send out a party to intercept them. It oughtn't to be a huge plot change, but some lurking and skulking might add tension to what is mainly a walking/talking scene. (That BBC dragon thrown in there - aaaahh!).

Imagine the irony of having to dodge the good guys, as well as the giants and other hazards. The Narnians might turn back at the bridge, because it was too risky to continue, thus emphasizing the dangers of the Northern wilds.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jan 22, 2014 3:29 pm

Thank goodness for that, Skilletdude. ;))

I think that's a brilliant idea, aileth! I wouldn't be surprised at all if the filmmakers did that. I do wonder what would make the rescue party give up and turn back, though, especially when there are two children involved. Maybe they'll have a run in with the Black Knight? Or possibly be intercepted by the Green Witch and taken to Underland to be enchanted/enslaved there?

Speaking of which (or witch? ;))), something I'd also like to find out more about is what happened to the "more than thirty champions" of knights, centaurs and good giants who set off in search of the lost prince and never returned to Narnia. I really don't think it's likely that all of them fell for the Lady of the Green Kirtle's Harfang trick.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Impending Doom » Jan 22, 2014 4:21 pm

That's a great idea aileth! I'd always thought, since there's a bit of walking and talking they'd want to add someone/something chasing them along for the same reasons you stated. But I have never thought of the good guys chasing them! I kind of want them to do this!

Speaking of which (or witch? ;))), something I'd also like to find out more about is what happened to the "more than thirty champions" of knights, centaurs and good giants who set off in search of the lost prince and never returned to Narnia. I really don't think it's likely that all of them fell for the Lady of the Green Kirtle's Harfang trick.


I would suspect most of them never even made it that far. It's more likely they were killed by giants, dragons, or natural elements.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jan 25, 2014 12:11 pm

Impending Doom wrote:I would suspect most of them never even made it that far. It's more likely they were killed by giants, dragons, or natural elements.


You're probably right, and it occurred to me that prior to Jill and Eustace showing up in Narnia, nobody had any idea where to even start looking for Rilian. I'm pretty sure the signs were only ever given to Jill, so that would have left the previous would-be rescuers going off in probably the wrong direction at least three-quarters of the time. Some of them may even return to Narnia after news of Rilian's return reaches them; it's only been ten years and many may still be alive.

Of course, the fact that the signs are largely secret could impede aileth's idea of having a search party following the trio, because they're not going to have any idea of where to look, either. This could probably be worked around, though. Jill and Eustace speak of the second sign at the Parliament of Owls and there could have been a spy listening in there, or one of the owls could turn informant. It's even possible that the LotK could have something to do with it, but these are all random ideas.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Lilygloves » Jan 25, 2014 1:24 pm

I don't know if the transition from our world to Narnia needs to be so dramatic or different. To be honest, if I were to do it I would do it suddenly, taking both the children and the audience by surprise. I would most likely use color and sound. I like the idea of the dullness of our world and the sudden color of Narnia, which would work because "it was a dull, autumn day". In my head, it was rainy and probably foggy and the grass and plants were already starting to die and the buildings weren't well groomed, so there is very little color. Also, while the children are being chased by the bullies, there will probably be fast music and lots of jeering from the bullies. When they enter Narnia, it could be like turning off a radio, as described in the book. This way, it doesn't need to be complex or that different from the book but the way I visualize it in my mind it works pretty well.
I am expecting "LOTR" shots for when they're traveling (the swooping scenery shots Peter Jackson uses so often). I am also expecting them to cut out Drinian, although this goes with the debate over whether it will be a sequel or its own thing. If it's a sequel and they want to use the same cast, Drinian was very pirate-y in VDT and he would seem really awkward and out of place in the courts of Cair Paravel. I doubt they will leave him in.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Aslanisthebest » Jan 26, 2014 5:15 pm

TSC is probably my favourite of the series, too, and so it's rather special, but there are a few things here and there that I think can be trimmed when transitioning the story from book to film.
One example of a scene that works really well in the book but could be shortened in the film is when Jill and Eustace spend time in the Narnian castle before Glimfeather comes to take them to the Parliament. I need to re-read the series, but I don't remember their time in the castle having any significant effect on the story. In the book, it serves the function of painting a very comfortable picture, which is then shaken when Glimfeather carries Jill away. Something like that can be depicted much faster in film, I think.

I can see the benefits of keeping Rilian's identity a mystery. I also am inclining towards any type of film that will remove Drinian and Liliandil, mostly for the sake of having a fresh start with this film. A flashback would be a little awkward, I think, so I think that an interesting way to portray it could be some kind of art, like a history book with pictures of what happened to the queen and then what Rilian did? I'm not sure who would narrate the events. Was it Glimfeather who did so in the books? Obviously, the art wouldn't be framed. Originally, I was thinking stained glass or something, but it makes no sense for Caspian to allow pictures of that around the castle... :P I would like the story of Rilian disappearing to be visually interesting, rather than the story just being narrated. It's an important part of the plot and, personally, it would stick with me longer if I saw what happened in some way rather than just heard about it. A montage with art, Prince-of-Egypt style, maybe, would be my suggestion.

A transition much like the Pevensies being chased by Mrs. Macready would work well, except it would be the Experiment House kids chasing Jill and Eustace.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby King_Erlian » Jan 28, 2014 5:16 am

In the film "The Miracle Maker", which is an excellent stop-frame puppet animation telling the story of Easter, they used the 3D stop-frame animation for the real events and went into 2D drawn-cartoon animation when Jesus told a parable, or when they went into someone's imagination. I thought it worked really well. Perhaps they could do something like that for The Silver Chair - if the main action were live action, use cartoon animation (not cutesy a la Disney!) for flashbacks such as Rilian's disappearance?
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Jan 31, 2014 6:24 pm

Aslanisthebest wrote:A flashback would be a little awkward, I think, so I think that an interesting way to portray it could be some kind of art, like a history book with pictures of what happened to the queen and then what Rilian did? I'm not sure who would narrate the events. Was it Glimfeather who did so in the books? Obviously, the art wouldn't be framed. Originally, I was thinking stained glass or something, but it makes no sense for Caspian to allow pictures of that around the castle... :P


In the SC: Predictable Twist Ending? thread, Reepicheep775 posted about the possibility of showing Rilian's backstory in the opening credits with art in some way, and stained glass windows was one of his suggestions. I had a thought that they might be windows in the Dark Castle in Underland, which would get around the problem of Caspian not wanting to be reminded of such a tragic event in his life! That was a very good point. ;))

I don't know if telling the story in the opening credits could end up hurting the scene in the Parliament of Owls, making it seem redundant, but I do love the visual of stained glass windows being illuminated by a lone lantern Underland, the light bobbing by each of them as the story is told. They could even be windows in the chamber of the Silver Chair (normally too dark to discern their design), with the opening credits ending as the ominous throne comes into view.

I'm not sure who the narrator for that would be, though. Maybe one of the hopeless voices of the gnomes, just to make it extra chilling and indicate the despair of the quest? Possibilities!
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Reepicheep775 » Jan 31, 2014 6:46 pm

The Rose-Tree Dryad wrote:I don't know if telling the story in the opening credits could end up hurting the scene in the Parliament of Owls, making it seem redundant, but I do love the visual of stained glass windows being illuminated by a lone lantern Underland, the light bobbing by each of them as the story is told.

The thought I had is that the Parliament of Owls could be a lot briefer than in the book. It wouldn't need to deliver as much information in the book, because much of the information would already have been given via the prologue. The audience would connect the information the owls are giving to the prologue and they could work out things for themselves. Either way, you don't want a long scene of exposition in a movie.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Aslan Fan » Feb 03, 2014 8:19 pm

I agree with you Dryad. I think they should drag out the scene with the gigantic serpent but I don't want to see a huge battle similar to VDT or something. It should be creepy and more long winded but also jumpy. It's a snake and big giant green snakes deserve to be creepy. :-s

Also, I think they could show the scene with Aslan blowing Jill and Eustace to Narnia with taste. I don't think they should take it out but just tweek it or abbreviate it or something. Maybe he breathes on Jill and the world begins to spin and Jill finds herself standing by Eustace in Narnia. I'm not sure if that's the best way. I would prefer a closer adaption of the scene but it's an idea. :-\

The scene with Jill and Eustace going through the door into Narnia probably shouldn't be changed. Yeah, underline the bullies, the horrible school, and maybe show some extra scenes to make the bullies more terrible and dreaded. But I don't think a iconic entry to Narnia should be changed altogether.
One of the rare things I loved about the movie VDT was the Picture scene. They didn't change the sequence but emphasized it and tweeked it to be more visually pleasing. It was one of the most memorable sequences of traveling into Narnia.

Also, I think the scene with the stupid giants throwing the stones should be another action scene that's emphasized. :D
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby AnimalOfNarnia » Feb 03, 2014 10:36 pm

None I can think of right now.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Aslan Fan » Feb 05, 2014 6:31 pm

AslanTheLion wrote:I want them to show more of Aslan in general. He is just so amazing.


I totally agree! They shouldn't take out any scenes with Aslan. He's the series icon and they should treat Him as such. I know they'll have to abbreviate stuff but they need to keep those scenes at least. :-bd
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Skilletdude » Feb 06, 2014 12:46 pm

I hope they don't abbreviate them. I think this book had the very best moments with Aslan interacting with the other characters, especially with Jill and later with a renewed Caspian. The dialogue is great too. In this case, his scenes are the ones I would not like them to change very much at all. Though he is a very expensive character to animate, maybe they will have to.
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby The Rose-Tree Dryad » Feb 06, 2014 4:03 pm

If they do end up significantly abbreviating the scenes with Aslan, I'm going to be seriously annoyed because I just don't think that the expense of CGI is a good excuse. ;)) There are ways of creatively capturing the essence of a scene without relying on special effects, and there are ways to indicate the presence of Aslan without always having him onscreen in all of his pricey, golden glory.

For instance, when Aslan first appears in The Silver Chair to blow Eustace into Narnia, Jill doesn't even recognize what kind of creature it is at first—it's just a "huge, brightly-coloured animal" bounding to the edge of the cliff. She does discern that it's a lion before Aslan returns to the forest, but it occurs to me that obscuring the identity and visuals of Aslan, at least in the beginning, could be helpful for a number of reasons, special effects expenses being one of them.

The other would be the fact that when Jill initially encounters Aslan in the forest, she believes he is going to eat her. While I don't like the idea of making Aslan seem more threatening than he was in the book, or make him appear that he's trifling with the poor girl, I do think that having Aslan largely unseen and unidentified at first would really help with causing the audience to feel the same fear that Jill feels.

It's possible that she wouldn't even see him at all by the cliff, but be aware of the sound and force of his breath, and with the camera angled in the direction of Eustace's disappearing form, the audience could just get a glimpse of something large and golden appearing behind Jill and causing a great wind. Then, when the wind is gone and the shape of Eustace has disappeared, Jill turns to look and only sees the back of an animal disappearing into the wood, and maybe even the footprints of a very large feline predator left behind.

Their initial conversation when Jill is dying of thirst could take place with Aslan largely obscured by the underbrush of the forest, with his voice coming from various angles as if he is circling her, giving the audience the impression that this is an animal stalking Jill, and that there is nowhere to run because the voice is coming from all sides. Then, once she has finally taken the drink from the stream and looks up, have Aslan be fully revealed, waiting by the water out in the open, looking exactly as Lewis described him—sitting like the lions in Trafalgar Square, bright and fiercely beautiful.

After this point, I'd like the rest of the conversation to progress pretty much as it does in the book, though you can always take advantage of focusing on Jill's face frequently and as well as wide shots to cut down on the amount of time a very detailed CGI Aslan is on screen. You could also cut out the visual of Aslan when Jill is walking towards the cliff, setting up the scene as if Aslan is carrying the camera, and when she turns to say goodbye, show Aslan as just a golden speck on a cliff that's already a hundred yards away, as the book describes.

Now, I'm not exactly an expert on filming or how to set up an impactful scene, camera-wise, but it seems to me that the above could be a decent example on how to cut down on the presence of a pricey CG lion without cutting down on the presence of the character of Aslan at all.

Goodness, this post ended up so much longer than I intended... I love dreaming about what the film might end up like. ;))
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Re: Differences you actually want

Postby Reepicheep775 » Feb 06, 2014 5:23 pm

^ I really like your ideas, Rose-Tree Dryad! Obscuring Aslan visually could indeed reinforce the idea that Jill is unsure/afraid of him. I'm getting goosebumps thinking of the possibilities.
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