You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Talk about any aspect of the films.

Moderator: daughter of the King

The Horse and His Boy for next film? Yea or neigh? :P

Yea!
12
63%
Neigh!
7
37%
 
Total votes : 19

You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby PhelanVelvel » Apr 03, 2013 11:43 pm

I just re-read it again and I don't know, as much as I also love The Silver Chair, there is part of me that is just absolutely mad about The Horse and His Boy. Now that I've read it again, there's so much that I love about it and I'm dying to see it on screen. I really love the "far east" fantasy setting of Calormen, I love Aravis as a warrior-like heroine, I love the dynamic between her and Shasta, and so many of the scenes are just awesome. When they ride over the ridge and see Tashbaan for the first time. Their moonlit race through the sea. The battle at Anvard, imagine if they did another great battle sequence like the one from LWW? It was also really fun seeing Lucy, Edmund, and Susan in their "golden age" times. It made it feel real, like that was something that really happened, they really did live years and years there and had even more adventures that we never really got to hear about in-depth in LWW.

Plus--it has horses! Who doesn't love horses? And it's a group of friends traveling together, that's a well-loved motif. It also has quite a few opportunities for humour. Lasaraleen and Corin spring to mind instantly. And I know it wouldn't be good to put too much romance in, since it wasn't really explored too much in the book, but Shasta and Aravis do get married, and they do grow fond of one another at the end of their journey, so they could put some romance in without completely deviating from the story the way they did in PC. I really want to see that relationship develop. It's so cute, the way they're bratty to one another and mature and grow close. I would be happier to see them kind of fall for one another at the end rather than just be like "Then later they got married" purely for the sake of "sticking to the book".

Sigh. Can they make this happen? :C I've been imagining what it would be like as a film since I read it as a kid...
User avatar
PhelanVelvel
NarniaWeb Nut
 
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby coracle » Apr 04, 2013 2:00 am

Romance is all very nice, but these kids are supposed to be no older than 14. Shasta is amazed that Aravis is to be married at her age.
I love this book very much, and have several favourite parts. I'd love to see it made as a film, although with the Pevensies appearing as adults in their 20s, it may be a bit too early.
User avatar
coracle
Moderator
NarniaWeb's Auntie
 
Posts: 19108
Joined: Feb 10, 2004
Location: Manchester, England
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby King_Erlian » Apr 04, 2013 5:15 am

I agree with Phelan, I think The Horse And His Boy would make a great film. If the filmmakers are worried about accusations of racism, they could make Calormen "multi-cultural" - have people from all races living there. After all, Calormen is supposed to be a huge empire that likes to "gobble up" little countries like Narnia, as the Tisroc says.

As for the romance element, I agree that if you kept the ages of Shasta and Aravis as they were in the book, it wouldn't work very well as they're still at the age where the opposite sex is "yeeuk!" But then they aged Caspian from about 14 to about 18 in the film of Prince Caspian, and that was still a good film. Though Shasta (and Corin) have to be young enough to need "looking after" by adults, for the scene with Shasta, Edmund and Susan in Tashbaan to work. If Shasta and Corin were 18, then the relationship between Corin and the Pevensies would be quite different. But if Shasta and Aravis were about 15 or 16, they could start to be interested in each other while still being regarded as children.

And, of course, I'd love to be in it... as King Lune, or the Tisroc... ;)
User avatar
King_Erlian
NarniaWeb Guru
 
Posts: 1410
Joined: Feb 03, 2012
Location: Northern England
Gender: Male

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Aslanisthebest » Apr 04, 2013 8:57 am

The Horse and His Boy is my favourite. I love Aslan and Shasta's interactions in it especially.
However, because it's my favourite, I'm a bit afraid of it being turned into a film. ;)) I'm thinking of a) all the ways they'd change the story b) how they'd probably lop off a lot of Aslan's lessons, leaving us doing endless talks about this and that and how such and such scene was really important to character development in the book and .... c) them making it a teen boppy romance.

I agree with coracle and King Erlian - I think it was Dinode who had mentioned in a thread that it would be okay if the movie could begin with Shasta, as King Cor, telling his children the story, and in the end, Aravis comes in the scene. Of course, they'd have to be very talented and not make it like the 'Good night, mom, good night, dad" "Good night, sweetie" dialogue from the Monster's Inc. simulators. :P

But, yes... I can just see them turning it into Girl and boy meet. Girl and boy detest each other. Boy softens towards girl, Girl softens towards boy, and they wuv each other.
I really appreciate how Shasta and Aravis could go on a journey without necessarily having romantic interest in one another. It took awkwardness out of certain things - if they were romantically interested, they couldn't bicker like good friends. And, also, it would look like Shasta saved Aravis because he was romantically interested in her (the whole overdone boy-saves-girl thing :P It's not what the scene is meant to be.) whereas he saved her because he cared about her as a person and friend. I was really glad they ended up together in the end, but I think that was a few years later... Shasta makes a comment about Aravis being pretty young... so I'm guessing that they're both probably 14 or 16? I'm not sure. I mean, Shasta was in battle, and I don't think King Lune would throw a young boy into battle. And Corin, Shasta's brother, is old enough to run away and traverse about, be thrown into jail and get beaten up, but still young enough to play pranks like that. I think they were mid-teen?

Thanks to Prince Caspian (it has made my overparanoid about romantic additions in films :P ), I'm worried they'll do a triangle between Cor, Corin, and Aravis. You just never know what to expect. :S

Another thing that I'm worried about is butchering the characters - making Shasta irresponsible and goofy and Aravis "in charge of everything." She was more haughty and she was a Tarkheena, so she had more training than Shasta. That must be acknowledged. It isn't like Shasta was stupid. Shasta was level-headed the way Hwin was level-headed in comparison to Bree, who was a much more experienced war horse than Hwin was. More than it being a gender stereotype, I think Lewis was trying to make a comparison between Aravis and Bree and then Shasta and Hwin, though Hwin was the most humble and agreeable in terms of personal faults in comparison to all. :P
And I'm also concerned they'd overdo the whole warrior-princess thing instead of just seeing Aravis as a character who was what she was.
Shasta and Aravis are complex, unique, lovable characters. I hope they can be translated to screen properly without reverting to character-lessening stereotypes.

Of course, depending on who is making it.... seeing VDT, I doubt they'd have Aslan's lesson to Aravis or much of his conversation with Shasta.
Sorry to be a wet blanket and name all the things that I am worried about! I really do have hopes for HHB and think it would be a great film. It's just that, it's my favourite, and so I'd be so worried what would be done to it. ;))
I would really love to see the scene by the tombs. I think HHB is a really cinematic book - almost every chapter can be translated into a movie. You can hear the soundtrack during Aslan's talk with Shasta and picture the dark trees around, you can hear crowds talking at Tashbaan, you can see Aravis and Las hiding behind the couch, you can see Aslan appearing while Bree is going on about Aslan. It has potential to be a great movie, chapter-for-chapter, even, I think.

I'd like to be in HHB, too. ;)) I don't really have the acting skills to be Aravis, but I wouldn't mind Lasaraleen, since I think my physical appearance is closer to hers, and I'm used to being cast as the fashion-obsessed diva. :P I've always pictured HHB as a really lovely movie. I'd love to work on it, more than I would like to act in it.
Image
RL Sibling: CSLewisNarnia
User avatar
Aslanisthebest
Moderator Emeritus
 
Posts: 5623
Joined: May 18, 2008
Location: Here

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby coracle » Apr 04, 2013 11:28 am

How old are they? Here's Kaleb's helpful list of ages:

http://www.narniaweb.com/resources-links/character-ages/
User avatar
coracle
Moderator
NarniaWeb's Auntie
 
Posts: 19108
Joined: Feb 10, 2004
Location: Manchester, England
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby PhelanVelvel » Apr 04, 2013 6:13 pm

People can have romantic feelings before eighteen...I don't see how them being young teens means they can't have a cute teen romance. Plus, since they do eventually end up together, I'd at least like to see it hinted at. By romance I don't mean like...hardcore snogging lol, I mean like, maybe a little kiss or just the way they look at eachother. It would be sweet.

Aslanisthebest wrote:But, yes... I can just see them turning it into Girl and boy meet. Girl and boy detest each other. Boy softens towards girl, Girl softens towards boy, and they wuv each other.


I mean, that's basically what it was in the book. I know they were friends first, but they got married. I don't know why people want to write off the romance element entirely, as if they got married out of convenience and didn't actually love one another. I'm not saying make the whole thing about romance, but I think towards the end they really did grow close both as friends and ultimately something more. They didn't bicker as good friends in the beginning, they bickered as people who didn't really click, from two different backgrounds. It developed into more and that's what I'm interested in seeing.

I don't mean I want it to be portrayed as a teeny-bopper romance, but as an innocent child-like romance that is based on friendship. I think people can identify with a best friend turning into something more, and it may have happened to them when they were teenagers. I'm not trying to cheapen their relationship, I'm just saying, when I read the book, I liked the way their relationship developed and I could see them as both being friends and kind of hinting at more.
User avatar
PhelanVelvel
NarniaWeb Nut
 
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Aslanisthebest » Apr 04, 2013 6:27 pm

Wow, that's really cool, coracle! Thanks for sharing that!

Phelan, I don't think anyone was saying that people younger than 18 can't be attracted to each other. Generally speaking (not speaking for myself or anything), people take 16-18 year olds having a romance more seriously than 13 year olds. Unless that's what you mean by "cute teen romance."

Rather - why can't a teenage boy and teenage girl go on a journey together without having interest in each other, as it was in HHB?
Why can't they just be friends, as Shasta and Aravis were until later in life? (maybe they liked each other a bit at the end; we're never told. But through the course of the story, they were friends.)
I guess it's just personal preference. It isn't in the book for a good reason and would take away from integral parts of the plot and character development for me. I'm not a fan of teen romances and I wouldn't think it'd be sweet - that's me. But you do, and that's you. :) Disagreement doesn't always mean that anyone is being unreasonable.
Image
RL Sibling: CSLewisNarnia
User avatar
Aslanisthebest
Moderator Emeritus
 
Posts: 5623
Joined: May 18, 2008
Location: Here

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby PhelanVelvel » Apr 04, 2013 6:54 pm

I'm not saying that anyone's being unreasonable, I don't think they liked one another through their journey. I'm saying at the end, when they start opening up to one another at the hermitage, I got the feeling that they might have feelings for one another. I get that teenagers don't always have the most serious relationships, but relationships can start there and grow into something serious later on.
User avatar
PhelanVelvel
NarniaWeb Nut
 
Posts: 178
Joined: Jan 28, 2013
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Meltintalle » Apr 05, 2013 11:55 am

I find myself in the HHB not-as-a-romance camp for many of the reasons Bella has put forward. I also think that, particularly by the hermitage scenes, there could be an opportunity to show that Shasta and Aravis will end up being more than friends.

But mostly I think that if the movie focuses on them being friends there'd be plenty of moments to make a shipper's heart happy--glances and romantic scenery and music etc.


Actually, just thinking about the possible scenery shots (can you imagine what the scene where Aslan appears to Shasta in the mountain pass would look like? All grey and gold and maybe a touch of pink...) makes me wish a movie would be made.
Image
Visit the Silver Chair Reading Group!
User avatar
Meltintalle
Moderator
Ra-pun-z-mel
 
Posts: 6824
Joined: Oct 06, 2005
Location: Scanning your bookcases

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby coracle » Apr 05, 2013 12:25 pm

Apart from the intentions of the author to write books for children that do not include the child characters having a romantic interest in one another, and the fact that Shasta is a downtrodden pre-adolescent, and Aravis being made to marry as almost a child bride...
The story is one of two young teens from different backgrounds and social levels who learn to get on and be good friends, and have an adventure while escaping to a better life for both of them.
For most of the story there is no time for peeping to see how cute each other is, or little kisses. It would ruin the story for most readers.
Lewis' comment at the end that when they grew up they were so used to fighting and making up that they got married for convenience... shows a long friendship, which I believe grew into an adult relationship, probably a slightly stormy one.
User avatar
coracle
Moderator
NarniaWeb's Auntie
 
Posts: 19108
Joined: Feb 10, 2004
Location: Manchester, England
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Aslanisthebest » Apr 05, 2013 1:15 pm

I think you edited, so a response to that:

Phelan wrote:I mean, that's basically what it was in the book. I know they were friends first, but they got married. I don't know why people want to write off the romance element entirely, as if they got married out of convenience and didn't actually love one another. I'm not saying make the whole thing about romance, but I think towards the end they really did grow close both as friends and ultimately something more. They didn't bicker as good friends in the beginning, they bickered as people who didn't really click, from two different backgrounds. It developed into more and that's what I'm interested in seeing.
Well, no, I don't think that's how it was in the book. It was two characters meeting each other, from different social leves (like coracle mentioned) who at first hated each other but then became friends. Aslan mentions that he brought Shasta and Aravis together for the journey - if there was romance at that point, before Aslan and Shasta have that conversation, that would sound a little awkward. They became friends then later, as they had a friendship, it might have grown into something else.
I don't know about "people," but I'd appreciated if you addressed what I as an individual said. I never said that I think they married out of convenience. I'm pretty certain they loved each other romantically when they got married. (C.S. Lewis satirically hints at that.)
You have a good point. In the beginning, yes, they bickered as two people who didn't like each other, but if I remember correctly, sometimes their bickering was just between small disagreements, not because they didn't like each other. And I don't think they were two bickering love birds - I think there was this fact that they were two friends who were trying to pursue a common goal. I think that's a strong relationship, and don't see why it needs to be, at that point, a romantic one.

I don't mean I want it to be portrayed as a teeny-bopper romance, but as an innocent child-like romance that is based on friendship. I think people can identify with a best friend turning into something more, and it may have happened to them when they were teenagers. I'm not trying to cheapen their relationship, I'm just saying, when I read the book, I liked the way their relationship developed and I could see them as both being friends and kind of hinting at more.
I understand what you're saying. For me, I'm not sure if I would like an innocent child-like romance.... because, well, it's hard to see how that wouldn't damage the other serious, deep parts of the plot. It'd be like A.A. Milne's Now We are Six. (IMO)
I can see how it can be hinted at a bit at the hermit's place (like Mel said), and seeing how the movie makers have a knack for casting older characters, they'd probably be 15-16, and so it wouldn't be like jr. highers giving looks to each other at summer camp.

Mel wrote:Actually, just thinking about the possible scenery shots (can you imagine what the scene where Aslan appears to Shasta in the mountain pass would look like? All grey and gold and maybe a touch of pink...) makes me wish a movie would be made.
Oh, yes, I was just thinking about that! I can just hear the soundtrack during their conversation. And then there's the following scene where Shasta sees the growing paw print and there's water in it which he refreshing himself with, and it's on a sunny hillside, and he hears the breeze and birds singing. That would be really lovely scenery for those parts!

I agree with what you said, coracle.
coracle wrote:The story is one of two young teens from different backgrounds and social levels who learn to get on and be good friends, and have an adventure while escaping to a better life for both of them.
That's exactly what makes me love HHB.
Image
RL Sibling: CSLewisNarnia
User avatar
Aslanisthebest
Moderator Emeritus
 
Posts: 5623
Joined: May 18, 2008
Location: Here

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby waggawerewolf27 » Apr 05, 2013 3:59 pm

Yes, I'd like to see a film of HHB, also. I agree the scenery would be spectacular. But it needs to be carefully handled to get a really good film. For instance, the point about Calormen is not about sexism or racism and that should be made abundantly clear. Nor is it really about any teenage romance between anyone.

Calormen is supposed to be a great empire that believes that it is okay for some people of higher rank to exploit others of lower rank. Calormenes have been led to think that life has to be their way, where less important people get out of the way of those who are more important. Calormen is full of warring nobles whose main concern in life is militarism, social position and wealth, whereas the poorer people are absorbed with mere survival. They are all led by the Tisroc, whose only concerns are his own comfort as the leader of a conquering Calormen, rather than the wellbeing of his people. And Ahoshta, himself, the Tisroc's head vizier, points out how romance is the last thing that matters in Calormen, even when marriages are organised. Unlike Narnia, where everyone does what they can do best and where under the king's authority and leadership, everyone is considered equally important.

Aravis has a genuine predicament - surely no young girl of 13 would want to marry a disgustingly ugly and deformed old man old enough to be her grandfather, whatever the social customs in force. But she despises Ahoshta because of his low birth most of all, which shouldn't have worried her nearly as much as what she later found out he had to do in bowing and scraping to his class superiors to get high status and a lot of money. The teenage issues are already there, I agree, when Aravis could say truthfully that she would rather marry her father's scullion than Ahoshta. However, that does not mean that she would seriously consider marrying someone like her father's scullion - or Shasta, either, for that matter.

Of course, both Shasta and her father's scullion would be much better-looking than Ahoshta, for one thing, being more Aravis' own age. But given the grindingly hard work such slaves would have to do, and the maltreatment often dished out to them, there is no guarantee that the scullion, too, might not end up looking just as deformed and ugly by the time he reached Ahoshta's age, if he was lucky enough to do so.

And obviously Lasaraleen thought Aravis was mad not to want to marry Ahoshta. Chances are, that Aravis, if she thought of marrying anyone at all, expected to marry someone more like Rabadash, Lazaraleen's pin-up boy, and HHB shows very clearly why marrying anyone like Rabadash might not be such a good idea, either. I'd really want the movie to bring out these points more than seeing some teenage romance. I'd want the movie to show the changes in Aravis's attitude from a snobbishly arrogant Tarkheena to the true-as-steel, honourable Aravis she really was, and that Shasta would eventually marry, when he was ready to do so.

Coracle wrote:Lewis' comment at the end that when they grew up they were so used to fighting and making up that they got married for convenience... shows a long friendship, which I believe grew into an adult relationship, probably a slightly stormy one.


Yes, that long friendship and their shared values are important to make the marriage worthwhile. They could not have married without these, especially as it was probably a stormy one at times. And the book is how Shasta and Aravis found grounds to be friends in the first place that is most important, more so than the actual, eventual marriage. I'm not saying that teenage romance isn't possible. But it isn't teenage changes that drive this particular romance.

Rather, it is the changes in character as they embark on their big escape together. The high point is supposed to be when Shasta delivers his message, then finally reaches Anvard, later telling Aravis how he suddenly changed from being the Calormene runaway slave to being the long lost heir to the Archenland throne. And it is most important that Aravis along the way learns that Shasta's worth isn't dictated by whether or not he was born a slave or a prince, but rather by what sort of person he is at heart.
User avatar
waggawerewolf27
NarniaWeb Zealot
 
Posts: 6694
Joined: Sep 25, 2009
Location: Oz
Gender: Female

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Nic5 » Apr 08, 2013 4:08 am

The only problem i'd have with Horse & His Boy next, is i'd want Andrew Adamson to direct it as it is my favorite Narnia book and i also think the story would be greatly suited to the type of film that would suit him (Cirque du solie in 3d was fantastic, if anyone saw, and that film also showed why Adamson would be great for Horse & His Boy, along with the two Narnia films he did, especially PC although that not a perfect film in of itself it's still the most & best Narnian film 2 me).

But i would like at least one more Narnian film before Andrew Adamson did another one, i would prefer two actually, MN then SC then Horse. I would rather Adamson in the background helping in the co-ordination of other visions of Narnia coming about before him doing another even though he would be my ideal pick for Horse and that is my favorite Narnia book.

Also the complaints about Susan/Caspian in PC would be put to rest as we'd see Susan finish off her arc in Horse that PC slightly hints at.

I wouldn't mind the Pevensies being older, in their later to middle twenties for Horse & it would be a great penultimate act into the last battle.

But the narnia films have been too divisive in their makings to think that a quality entire chronicle series is going to come about or happen at all.

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

THis is a bit of an after thought but do the ages really matter in the cinema counterparts? My pick is not as long as the essence of the drama is the same - which can get lost on people who's only see the story as, well it said such and such an noun, why didnt it that? Just depends on what people like and get out of the books i guess.

Anyhow, for MN could have younger characters, near the same age as in the book, along with Tilda Swinton as Jadis. Then for SC have Will Poulter with Jill same age as him, slightly raised from the book to match & with same drama transposed to that. Then for Horse & His Bou, have the Pevensies who are even older by that film, come into it. So it's a kind of progression from here on out for the movies, and then they all come together for Last Battle.

I think the series can survive one Voyage of the Dawn Treader story mis-hap and in a series of films it would have a unique value in the kind of watch it is, even if story itself has to be ignored somewhat. But i don't think Narnia films could survive another one.
User avatar
Nic5
NarniaWeb Regular
 
Posts: 54
Joined: May 18, 2011
Gender: Male

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby King_Erlian » Apr 23, 2013 6:28 am

coracle wrote:How old are they? Here's Kaleb's helpful list of ages:

http://www.narniaweb.com/resources-links/character-ages/


I don't entirely agree with this list; in particular, I don't think Eustace and Jill are as young as 9 in The Silver Chair. The reason for this is Lewis' description of their school, Experiment House. For them to be only 9, then Experiment House would have to be either a primary school (ages 5 to 11) or a preparatory school or "prep" school (ages 8 to 13). Prep schools are fairly rare, at least today; I'm not sure whether they were significantly more common in the 1940s or '50s. Usually, prep schools were/are attached to a boarding school or an expensive private school for older children, possibly a public school (a "public school" in Britain is an exclusive and expensive private school, the exact opposite of a "public school" in the States, which is the equivalent of a British "State school"). As such, prep schools tend to be run in a traditional way, not the progressive approach of Experiment House.

On the other hand, Experiment House doesn't sound like a primary school either; and if it were, then They (the bullies) would have been no older than 11, and whilst the narrative doesn't say how old they were, I get the feeling that they were older than that. Besides, the way Lewis describes the school, it sounds like a modern secondary school, making Eustace and Jill at least 11.
User avatar
King_Erlian
NarniaWeb Guru
 
Posts: 1410
Joined: Feb 03, 2012
Location: Northern England
Gender: Male

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby twinimage » Apr 29, 2013 7:19 am

I think HHB has the best potential of being adapted into a film. It would make for a great adventure film. The Calorman setting would definitely be a nice change of pace and look great on film. It would need a good script, a visionary director and no name actor's to play the children. Else, I don't want it to be made until someone like that comes along.

I think what makes me want to see this one more than the others is because it's so separate from the rest of the books. It's not really dependent or connected to any of the other books. You could make the movie any time you want and not worry about the previous films.

As for adding a young romance, I would have to respectfully disagree. Their relationship in the story can't turn into a romance or "something more than friends", because they are NOT friends until the end of the story. The entire story they don't like each other until the end, when they finally have a mutual respect for each other. I know in movies relationships move MUCH faster than that, but it would be much cooler if they learn to appreciate each others differences, rather than force a romance that two young actors may not have the chemistry for.
User avatar
twinimage
NarniaWeb Nut
 
Posts: 275
Joined: Jan 30, 2009
Location: U.S.

Re: You know what, I want The Horse and His Boy next.

Postby Glumpuddle » Jun 03, 2013 7:07 pm

Anna Popplewell says she'd return for HHB.
http://www.narniaweb.com/2013/06/anna-p ... to-narnia/
Image
YouTube.com/gpuddle | Facebook.com/gpuddle | Twitter.com/glumpuddle
User avatar
Glumpuddle
NarniaWeb Fanatic
News Poster, Podcaster
 
Posts: 4882
Joined: May 14, 2004
Location: United States
Gender: Male

Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests